Want to Live a Good life? Here's what Ancient Greece had to say.

[Ron Price]

CUPID AND PSYCHE



Cupid was an emblem of the heart, in Greek mythology. Psyche was the personification of the soul and represented by the form of butterfly wings. Psyche suffered a great deal in her efforts to learn about love and faith. After much suffering, caused by the jealousy of her sisters and her own inability to keep a promise, Cupid and Psyche were married. -Ron Price from H.A. Guerber,Greece and Rome: Myths and Legends, Chancellor Press, London, 1995(1907), pp. 127-137.

Such a happy ending after wandering,

a victim of the heart’s desires and the

slings and arrows of mysterious fortune!

Is it always so?

Such beauty, such a heavenly gem, delicate

sweetness, mystery of mysteries, moves and

is still, whose fruit, whose light, a butterfly.

Is it always so?

No voice, no lute, no pipe, no incense

can tell of Her divinely ordained and subtle reality,

fairer than the sapphire-regioned galaxies

or bowers of flowers.

Is it always so?

This heart’s home of fleeting fancies takes Her

airy lightness far from its vitalizing power, beauteous

hour, resplendent luminaries of the atom or drop.

Is it always so?

Your visage appears warn, loveliest vision

in heaven’s unknown hierarchy, enjoying closeness

to thousands of other dancing wings,

but stained now with earthly desires,

the taint of Your memories,

Your waywardness, a remoteness

from Your own wondrous beauty,

its vast and inner mysteries.

Is it always so?

Even though You have been preoccupied

with Your patterns which can not fatten

nor appease the hunger, You can but sing

and be great choirs as well as moan

in late night fires. You’ll be a shrine,

a grove, a pipe, for Your own soul linked to some eternal Light.

Is it always so?

29/11/96.

[KnightoftheRose]

Argh! I wrote a long reply and my Mozilla bombed out!

Anywho...

Like I said compare the crime rate (reagrdless of the population size) in the middle east and south Europe to the USA and the North of Europe and you will be shocked. Check out the rate.

Ok, first of all, let me point this out: in order for a crime rate to be accurate, the cops have to report the crime. I lived in Bahrain for three years, and let me tell you, the police were *corrupt*. If a member of a somewhat important family (and almost every family in bahrain was at least somewhat important) were to commit a crime, you could almost be guaranteed a police would aid him in covering it up. Heck, you could pretty much murder your Hindu maid and no one would care. It happened quite frequently. Think *that* got written up by the cops to influence the national statistics on crime rate?

And I wouldn't trust a European cop to do his job further than I could throw him. Bad experiences.

*Further*...the crime rate in America is disproportional. Some key cities pretty much supply all the crime in the states. Elsewhere, you're pretty safe.

Anyways, my point is - crime rate means nothing.

Exactly look at Japan, they have the lowest crime rates in the world and they have also managed to be one of the most technologically advance country in the world.

That has nothing to do with what I was talking about. My point earlier was that Japan considers infidelity acceptable, and thus Japan is more "unfaithful" than America. Which destroys your argument that such activities are highest in the west. I'm not judging anyone, just pointing out the facts.

My theory is that people of ethnic origin whose ancestors have lived in ancient civilisations are the least likely people to commit crime.

Egypt, Israel, Palestine, India, China, any Southeast Asian country, South America in general...these countries are all quite violent, and prone to crime. It has nothing to do with ethnicity. It has everything to do with poverty.

Also its fact that people of northern Europe were barbaric, these people are ancestors of the Anglo American. The people of south Europe mainly the Greeks and Romans, built a lot of the cites in Europe and started civilisation, this means that people of northern Europe were also put in civilisations before there time.

So? How much breeding do you suppose has gone on between the "North" Europeans and the "South" Europeans? I doubt there are that many people left in Europe who are "pure blooded".

Iraq is a place where one of the first civlisations were found, apart from the dictated that was put in power by the americans in the first place, the people of Iraq are very peaceful.

Indeed. Putting Sadam into power was a sin of ours - a sin we recently put to rest. Hopefully the citizens of Iraq can enjoy some peace once again.

[quote]Makes you wonder who really should be invaded.[quote]

Iran?

I said it. You can carry out your witch hunt now.

I wouldn't give you the pleasure of martyrdom.

But I hope you see that my intesntions are not wrong, only educating. this is no attack on anyone.

Educating? Beyond slightly racist comments, a degrading view of western society, and a call to arms against America, what exactly have you said that is "educating"?

Only the truth.

Uh-hunh.

[Postmaster]

Well, you make your argument, I have no energy to argue more. But it’s ok for the west to degrade Islam and suicide bombers and terrorists. Maybe they should simply take a look at the Bee. Discrimination is part of life, we do it every day when we open the door for a lady. But I stand by it that people of Ancient civilisations are less likely to commit a crime. Doesn't mean I personally am any less likely to commit a crime, then someone from Germany or anywhere else in the world.

[Faithfulservant]

how do you degrade terrorists and suicide bombers? I also dont think its discrimination to open the door for a lady.. I think thats called good manners.

[Postmaster]

I degrade the way they go about there cause, but I don't degrade there cause. Maybe, but we can't go throughout life without discriminating. That would still be a form of discrimination at its lowest level, but we still discriminating men just because of there sex. I'm not saying its a bad thing, I'm only saying that discrimination is part of life... Like everything when you take it to the extreme and out of balance then I suppose its wrong.

[Faithfulservant]

I personally degrade their cause.. I was watching the news when the second plane hit the WTC.. I, along with the rest of my countrymen grieved the losses in that day. We were attacked by terrorists and suicide bombers. Please dont post back and tell me you think it was justified because we amercans are corrupt and live sinful lives.. that wouldnt be very tactful.

[Postmaster]

Noo, you have me all wrong Faithful servant, that’s not what I think. The attacks were wrong full stop, they can’t be justified. But there cause may be justified, you see I may not know the truth as to why those attacks happened. Some conspiracy theorists even claim it to be work of the American government themselves and just like many instances its very unlikely for anyone to know the truth. However, the most likely theory is, of the way the USA treats people of the middle east within a political content, things we are unaware of and things I might understand a little better. USA is the biggest super power in the world, demcracy works by Majority vote wins, but often other ethnic gropus outside of the country might not have this right in American politics Also too many rich and powerful people have a say in US, UK and European politics. Its all about money with the essence of religon. And sometimes the only way people can be heard is by extreme measures.. What has the anti-war protests done for the war in iraq? Nothing... How about if violence got involded? Maybe they would be heard better? Unfortuanatly that is the last resort.. Just like the bee?

[Vajradhara]

i would heartily suggest a reading of Spencer Wells remarkable book "The Journey of Man" after which, you will come to the understanding that the entire ethnicity of humanity comes from one source, a Bushman tribe in Africa.

[Postmaster]

Indeed we are.. But each ethnic group took different paths and some of our ancestors lived in civilisations before hand and our genes still carry this stigma.. That's why no one should take offence to what I say.. It’s just a theory and it does hold weight but were all human, one mother and one father.. But groups of us are more developed for living in civilisations.. Can you see where I'm coming from? Just like some ehtinic groups are faster at running, and some are better thinkers for example the aboriginals have extremely good memorie compared to rest of us. Some of our ancestors lived in caves whilst others wrote philosophy astrology and mathematics.. Sounds bad to say, but its true. But this is one of the factors of crime in society these days. Chinese and Japanese peoples ancestors lived in very early civilisations and they have very low crime rate.. Hunter gatherer attitude in peoples genes is what gives them the urge to rob someone.

[Vajradhara]

Namaste postmaster,

thank you for the post.

Originally Posted by Postmaster

Indeed we are.. But each ethnic group took different paths and some of our ancestors lived in civilisations before hand and our genes still carry this stigma..

actually, no, they didn't.

they took one single path out of Africa... from there to India and then to the Aborgines of Australia, from India into Central Asia...and from Central Asia, to Europe and North America.

quite fascinatingly, the family that carries the genetic marker is still in Central Asia... this family, is the family of all the Europeans and Aborigines of North and South America.

unless you mean something like a cultural path??

what "stigma" are you referring to? do you have any scientific data to support your assertions that "stigmas" and "attitudes" are actually genetic traits that are passed on?

That's why no one should take offence to what I say.. It’s just a theory and
it does hold weight but were all human, one mother and one father.. But groups of us are more developed for living in civilisations.. Can you see where I'm coming from?

well... frankly.. no. in point of fact, i can look at every ethinicity in the world and see that they live in a civilization. perhaps you mean something else? like cities or modern industrialized civilization?

Just like some ehtinic groups are faster at running, and some are better thinkers for example the aboriginals have extremely good memorie compared to rest of us.

i completely, whole-heartedly disagree with this statement. some people are faster than others and there doesn't seem to be any scientific reason to draw distinctions in this regard due to ethnicity.

how can you say that? how many of the "rest of us", which would be the entire world, do you know that you can make a statement like "aboriginals have extremely good memorie compared to rest of us"?

i'm really not sure how you could come to that conclusion without actually going through the process of some sort of method to test the memories of folks.

Some of our ancestors lived in caves whilst others wrote philosophy astrology and mathematics.. Sounds bad to say, but its true. But this is one of the factors of crime in society these days. Chinese and Japanese peoples ancestors lived in very early civilisations and they have very low crime rate.. Hunter gatherer attitude in peoples genes is what gives them the urge to rob someone.

what are you talking about?

i think that you need to re-examine your evidence... especially with regards to China.

you do realize, do you not, that attitudes are not genetic? this is why you see bumper stickers that say things like "hate is not inherited" and "hate is not a family value" and all of that sort of thing.

i would, by contrast, contend that extreme poverty is more likely to motivate someone to rob than some sort of inherited attitude regarding hunting or gathering.

[Postmaster]

actually, no, they didn't.

they took one single path out of Africa... from there to India and then to the Aborgines of Australia, from India into Central Asia...and from Central Asia, to Europe and North America.

quite fascinatingly, the family that carries the genetic marker is still in Central Asia... this family, is the family of all the Europeans and Aborigines of North and South America.

unless you mean something like a cultural path??

what "stigma" are you referring to? do you have any scientific data to support your assertions that "stigmas" and "attitudes" are actually genetic traits that are passed on?

Parents pass on genetic information to there child, it changes with every generation, its not as a long process as you think it is.

well... frankly.. no. in point of fact, i can look at every ethinicity in the world and see that they live in a civilization. perhaps you mean something else? like cities or modern industrialized civilization?

All Europeans originated out of Asia but for some reasons the ones that went up north still carried on hunter gathering. Whilst the ones in the south and distinctively the Minoians who were also the first original Greek race, built civilisations, this means that they lived with a lot of people in a system with culture. The Minoans went all the way to Spain and this is why they have the symbol of the Bull that’s from the Greek Minoans. Do you know what lay beyond the Greek kingdom of Macedonia and the Rome Empire? Barbaric Tribes they were the ones which did not set up civilisation and still practised hunter gathering.

Do you know that it was the Greeks and Romans which built many of the cities in Europe, including London, The Greeks built Rome and Venice and a lot of the cites in the Mediterranean. The people southern Europe come from the Minoans right up to Portugal. Yes the Romans were barbaric yes the Greeks were but you should read some history about the Barbaric tribes of Europe, there life styles and way of life were very low and at the time of the Minoan civilisations they were living animal life styles. The Minoans were actually an Indian tribe originally and so were all people of Europe but the Minoans set up cultivation before rest. And after the Minoians came the Mycenaean greeks ect.


Why is south Europe more relgious then north? Can't you see any sort of trend as I do? And as for the Chinese they built the great wall of China to keep out the mogolians who were one of the most barbaric people that lived in this world.. Do not confuse them with the Chinese.. Also do not confuse government activity with the inhabitants of a country. Did the indians come and split up Europe like the British did to Pakistan and India to brake up her power? Nope she was too peacfull, full of religon and happiness. Who caused the trouble in the middle east?

[mirrorinthefog]

What on earth are you talking about????
Anyone under the right circumstances is capable of violence-regardless of what their inclinations may or may not be. The key is to recognize what ones potentials are and use them to ones advantage-to build and not to destroy. That's what makes us sentient, is it not?
Every civilization, in the process of expanding, has engaged in war and resorted to what one might consider "uncivilized" measures to maintain order and compliance. No one group of people is above criticism.
Not only are you being one-sided, but you are using a method of reasoning that is tantamount to racial and ethnic profiling-how is it civilized to categorize people and force them into boxes based on their parentage, without regards to their individual capabilities beyond what genetically they might have the potential for?

[Postmaster]

Well, people naturally defensive about this or maybe I'm wrong I would edmit if I was, but this all came out of why there is high crime in the west and I was pointing out as one factor.. I might be wrong, I'm not saying I'm right, its just things I read.. Also it’s true, we are all human no individual has less or more chance committing a crime compared to anyone else in the world.. But if we look at it on a large scale it’s true.. There is less crime in south Europe then there is in north Europe and that is also a fact.

[Vajradhara]

Namaste Postmaster,

thank for you for the post.

Originally Posted by Postmaster

Parents pass on genetic information to there child, it changes with every generation, its not as a long process as you think it is.

nonesense and ill informed nonesense at that. seriously... you are proposing mutations at every generation! do you know what you are saying?!

All Europeans originated out of Asia but for some reasons the ones that went up north still carried on hunter gathering. Whilst the ones in the south and distinctively the Minoians who were also the first original Greek race, built civilisations, this means that they lived with a lot of people in a system with culture.

and all you need to do is present some evidence that this is so.

what do you mean by the word "civilization" for i think you are equiviocating this word to mean something other than it's plain meaning.

The Minoans went all the way to Spain and this is why they have the symbol of the Bull that’s from the Greek Minoans. Do you know what lay beyond the Greek kingdom of Macedonia and the Rome Empire? Barbaric Tribes they were the ones which did not set up civilisation and still practised hunter gathering.

it's always interesting to see how racial bigotry is played out. the "others" are always barbarians and uncultured louts that can barely stand upright. sheese.

come now Postmaster, are you seriously asserting that the Greek people didn't hunt or gather their food? what... did it just fall from the sky for them?

Do you know that it was the Greeks and Romans which built many of the cities in Europe, including London, The Greeks built Rome and Venice and a lot of the cites in the Mediterranean.

indeed. you can still see Roman roads in Europe, as well as some bridges and aquaducts.

Remus and Romulous built Rome. if you think that is not the case, please bring forth some intersubjective evidence to substantiate your claim. why would the Greeks have built Rome when they were still busy with their city-states on the Macedonian pennensula?

Why is south Europe more relgious then north?

do you have any sort of statistics or evidence to support this claim? this is a very subjective view point.

Can't you see any sort of trend as I do? And as for the Chinese they built the great wall of China to keep out the mogolians who were one of the most barbaric people that lived in this world

oh goodness. no, that is not at all why the wall was built. the wall was built to keep the mongols from returning to mongolia with all the loot they plundered.. as the most advanced military the in world, at the time, the mongolian hordes could simply ride around the Great Wall. in point of fact, there is more than the one wall, there are several of the things scattered about the country.

furthermore, the Mongolians became one of the most cultured and sophisticated peoples in the world during this time. they ruled from China in the East to Romania in the West, from Arabia in the South to Russia in the North, providing safe travel for merchants throughtout the empire. if you have a serious interest in Mongolian history, i would encourage you to read a book called "The Devils Horsemen".

.. Do not confuse them with the Chinese.. Also do not confuse government activity with the inhabitants of a country.

why would one do that? Chinese are not Mongolians.. there are 8 different ethnicities that comprise the "chinese" people, some of whom are of Mongolian descent.

Did the indians come and split up Europe like the British did to Pakistan and India to brake up her power? Nope she was too peacfull, full of religon and happiness. Who caused the trouble in the middle east?

er... Pakistan was created by the United Nations after the British left India. it was created to be a seperate state for the large Muslim population of India. it did not exist as a seperate state before that time.

so.. your position is that colonialism was a detriment to the world? i think that you'd be hard pressed to find any that would disagree with that view.

who caused trouble in the Middle East? the Ottomans. why?

[Postmaster]

Originally Posted by Postmaster
Parents pass on genetic information to there child, it changes with every generation, its not as a long process as you think it is.

nonesense and ill informed nonesense at that. seriously... you are proposing mutations at every generation! do you know what you are saying?!

It changes with every generation, at a very very tiny level, never the less it still changes. But Gene's still make almost exact copies from one to the other.
http://www.people.virginia.edu/~rjh9u/humtrait.html

er... Pakistan was created by the United Nations after the British left India. it was created to be a seperate state for the large Muslim population of India. it did not exist as a seperate state before that time.

There are still Muslims in India and there are still Hindus and sikhs in Pakistan, I was actaully talking to a British Indian who has a degree in History about it last night at work a father with children. The British empire left India and split her up to brake up her power and rivalry by relgion not race, how many religons are there in Greece and who has a problem with it? Why would that be any differnt in India? One of saddam’s closest men was a Christian and thats a fact.