The Trinity of Christianity

[Marietta]

Hello Quahom,
The Spirit is always there to reveal things to those who seek. However this world we live in is full of confusion and we are all in a state of confusion put there by design by the Fallen Ones agenda of control.
I totally agree that when in doubt go to the Source in Prayer. I want to testify to the fact that if you stay in a state of prayer (which is a heart longing for something, in this case divine truth) answers will come. However sometimes we don't understand what we are hearing and it takes years and years of listening and lining our little duckies up in a row and having them all knocked down and rearranging them to come to even the simplest of truths and then we still question and add to our ducks. This puzzle we are trying to put together at first glance seems small but the more pieces we find and put into place the larger the overall puzzle become until it in compasses all that is and can become overwhelming.

Love and Light, Midge

[Marietta]

Hello Dor,

Are you speaking literally or figuratively?

You stated:
""I can see God, and talk to God and feel God on a daily basis. He is not some inpersonal force or some state of consciousness."""



Love and Light, Midge

[Dor]

Originally Posted by Marietta

Hello BlaznFattyz, Thank you for sharing your thoughts on this with me.
My thoughts are as follow.

Lets start with the creation of man in Genesis 1:26, 27. Begining with the Hebrew word that has been translated as God, Elohim (ahleph, lamed, hey, yud, mem) (the English equivalent: a, l, h, y, m). This word translates Goddesses plural. ahleph, lahmed (El) is the Hebrew for God and ahleph, lahmed, hey is Goddess the yud mem is the plural ending. To make this mean Gods you have to take the hey out of the middle. Its like men and women, the female holds a more balanced polarity

Strong's Number: 0430 Browse Lexicon Original WordWord Origin~yhlaplural of (0433)Transliterated WordTDNT Entry'elohiymTWOT - 93cPhonetic SpellingParts of Speechel-o-heem' Noun Masculine Definition

1. (plural)
   1. rulers, judges
   2. divine ones
   3. angels
   4. gods
2. (plural intensive - singular meaning)
   1. god, goddess
   2. godlike one
   3. works or special possessions of God
   4. the (true) God
   5. God

The word translated as man is Adam (aleph, daleth, mem) and means to be red or more literally gas from red blood and simply refers to red blooded mankind. There is another Hebrew word that means the male, or man. They were created holding both male and female energy in a perfect balance and more than one being was created. Not one single man from which all else emerged.

Strong's Number: 0120 Browse Lexicon Original WordWord Origin~dafrom (0119)Transliterated WordTDNT Entry'adamTWOT - 25aPhonetic SpellingParts of Speechaw-dawm' Noun Masculine Definition

1. man, mankind
   1. man, human being
   2. man, mankind (much more frequently intended sense in OT)
   3. Adam, first man
   4. city in Jordan valley

Hmm says right there man. Of course if you just read where it says he created man it wouldnt fit with the man-made doctrine you want to spread, so he had to have created some kind of a cross between both. Well try just reading it he said he made man and made woman from him it isnt that hard to read.

Please give me the specific chapter and verse you are referring to where Moses referred to God with masculine titles?

Exodus 5:3 And they said, The God of the Hebrews hath met with us: let us go, we pray thee, three days' journey into the desert, and sacrifice unto the LORD our God; lest he fall upon us with pestilence, or with the sword.
But really that isnt a masculine title but since Moses wrote the first 5 books there are numerous times he used a title. See elohiym-Noun Masculine which is used 189 times in Genesis alone.


The Jesus in the Last Supper is not a woman and even if it was. DaVinci and Dan Brown dont really know everything people say they do.

[Dor]

Originally Posted by Marietta

Hello Dor,

Are you speaking literally or figuratively?

You stated:
""I can see God, and talk to God and feel God on a daily basis. He is not some inpersonal force or some state of consciousness."""



Love and Light, Midge

I speak literally. Now that being said where I see God non-believers and corrupters may not see him or hear him or feel him. We each have our own personal interactions with him all it takes is belief and faith.

[Marietta]

Hello Dor,
Are you aware that the original text was not broken down into words or paragraphs? The Original Hebrew/Aramaic was written in on long string of letters. The true means of translating Hebrew is said to be like building a house with each letter being a brick in the house. Each letter in the Hebrew aleph Bet has a meaning and then there are sets of letters that make up meanings that you must build upon.

I'm not sure what you are trying to show here because what you have shown states pretty much what I have already stated.

My reference comes from the Etymological Dictionary of the Hebrew Language. I also use the Dictionary of the Targumim, Talmud Babli, Yerushalmi purchased at the Hebrew Union Collage and is the dictionary recommended to all students there.

According to the Etymological Dictionary of the Hebrew Language

El: ahleph, lahmed:1. orig. a noun meaning 'nothing' 2. adv. expressing prohibition, a negative wish or request, and meaning 'not', 'nay' derived from base; "to be weak"
3. god (of uncertain etymology) Formerly most scholars derived the word from the base ahleph, vav, lahmed) 2. power 3. these

Eloh: ahleph, lahmed, hey: 1. Goddess 2. obligation by oath

Elohim: 1. supernatural beings 2. gods plural

It looks like Strong's has done some justice to the meaning of the word 430 elohim it however it is both masculine and feminine. The im ending has in more recent times been used as a masculine plural ending but it was not intended as such. According to the Mishna there are only ten rules that are ever to be applied to the Hebrew writings known the ten utterances and they have to do with the vibration of a letter (the tone it carries).

When translating a language you take a word from language and give it the meaning in another language, so lets see what man means in an English dictionary.

Webster's
Man: 1. human being 2. man

Go back to my post and you will see that I stated that the word Adam refers to mankind as a whole The first being held both polarities before eating of the tree of good and evil (polarity). Adam was both male and female until the supposed rib was taken. Which is a twisted way of saying that polarity broke into polar opposites.
Use your Strong's Concordance along with a interliner bible and look up the meaning of each word in the test that says a rib was taken from Adam. Also take note of the words in the text and the words given as the meaning. You'll find they don't all match.

Why are you getting upset and making accusations intended to put another on the defensive. Have I offended you in some manner? If so please accept my apologies. If I have said something out of line that has upset you, I am unaware of what it was. I am sorry for whatever has provoked this attack. Attack is never the AMO of Source only Pure Love.
Please ask God the next time you commune with him (your choice of signature) if I am out to promote something against the Divine. I also talk to Source daily and though I do not see Source I do hear a voice that gives me answers.
Which brings me to the question of how can you see God when the bible specifically states that Nobody can see God and live.


You wrote:
""""Of course if you just read where it says he created man it wouldnt fit with the man-made doctrine you want to spread, so he had to have created some kind of a cross between both. Well try just reading it he said he made man and made woman from him it isnt that hard to read."""

May I ask what makes the doctrine you are promoting any less manmade than what you accuse me of? We are both sharing what we see in the same scriptures.

You quoted this verse:
Exodus 5:3 And they said, The God of the Hebrews hath met with us: let us go, we pray thee, three days' journey into the desert, and sacrifice unto the LORD our God; lest he fall upon us with pestilence, or with the sword.
But really that isnt a masculine title but since Moses wrote the first 5 books there are numerous times he used a title. See elohiym-Noun Masculine which is used 189 times in Genesis alone.

Here is a very literal word for word definition of this verse. Please look each word up for yourself and tell me what you think. Check the word used in the meaning given in strong's against the word in the actual Hebrew text. By the way the ninth word in this text is the Hebrew word for man.

Exodus
Chapter five
First word vav, ahleph lahmed he: vav: conjunction; therefore. ahleph, lahmed, he: goddess, to swear an oath:

Second word: shin, mem, vav, taw: shin:=who. that , which mem, vav, taw:= to die, death.

Third word: Beth, nun, yud: beth:=within. nun, yud:=wailing (mistranslated as son which is ben, nun, there is a third letter yud making it a different word).

Fourth word: yud, shin, rehsh, ahleph, lahmed: Israel which translates: =yud, shin, rehsh:= to be straight, upright, pleasing, uprightness. ahleph, lahmed:= god, these, power

Fifth word: hey, beth, ahleph, yud, mam
hey, beth, ahleph, yud:=nonsensical, exageration, nonsence
mem:= of, from

OR:
hey, beth:= give
ahleph, yud, mem: fearful, to frighten, to threaten, terrible

Or'
hey:=the
beth, ahleph: subsequent
yud, mem:= hot springs

Sixth word: mem, tzadi, rehsh, yud, mem, hey:
mem:=from
tzade, rehsh, yud, mem, hey:= dissonance

Or:

mem, tzade, rehsh, yud, mem:= Egyptian
hey:= the

Or:

mem, yzade, rehsh:=boundry
yud, mem, he:= lake

Seventh Word: ahleph, tav: with

Eighth word: yud, ayin, kuf, beth: = Jacob : action seen the sun on the horizon within

Ninth word: ahleph, yud, shin (ash) : = man, opposite of woman

Tenth word: vav, beth, yud, tav, vav:
vav:=therefore, and
beth, yud, tav:= domestic, domesticate, family, house

vav:= therefore
beth, yud: in me
tav, vav: once more

You wrote:
"""The Jesus in the Last Supper is not a woman and even if it was. DaVinci and Dan Brown dont really know everything people say they do.""""

The Jesus in the Last Supper isn't man nor woman Jesus is androgynous holding a perfect balance of gender but looking more feminine. I have not read the DaVinci Code or any of Dan Brown's books. I came upon this at least fifteen years ago while doing research for a book I was writing. If you blow the picture of the last supper up you will see that not only is the figure of Jesus dressed in female garb, this being does not have a beard but a shadow that disappears when blown up. It is very obvious that there are six males and six females.

Love and Light, Marietta

[Marietta]

Hello Dor,
You wrote:
"""I speak literally. Now that being said where I see God non-believers and corrupters may not see him or hear him or feel him. We each have our own personal interactions with him all it takes is belief and faith."""

Now, Now, no reason to be so nasty. Ego has no place in a discussion about the scriptures. Lets have a discussion in peace and harmony. Anger only brings distruction.

You are Loved, and that is what you should focus upon whcih will help you let go of the anger. Everything is ok and in God's Divine Right Order no matter how or who may challenge your belief system. Leave the Judging to the higher parts in the higher realms where things are seen more clearly. God allows for all expression and thoughs regarding what we perceive as reality.

With Love and Light, Midge

[kenod]

Originally Posted by Marietta

Now, Now, no reason to be so nasty. Ego has no place in a discussion about the scriptures. Lets have a discussion in peace and harmony. Anger only brings distruction.

The "new age” philosophy of peace and harmony at all costs, does not fit comfortably within Christian beliefs. There is a clear right and wrong intrinsic to Jesus’ teaching. Even anger has a place.

He looked around at them in anger and, deeply distressed at their stubborn hearts, said to the man, “Stretch out your hand.” He stretched it out, and his hand was completely restored. (Mark 3:5 NIV)

“Do not suppose that I have come to bring peace to the earth. I did not come to bring peace, but a sword. (Matthew 10:34 NIV)

btw, this is not to say that I saw any sign of anger in Dor’s post, for I did not - we all make assumptions - some right some wrong - for example, I may be wrong to assume you are attempting to gain the high moral ground by your "peace and harmony" rebuke.

[Quahom1]

Originally Posted by kenod

The "new age” philosophy of peace and harmony at all costs, does not fit comfortably within Christian beliefs. There is a clear right and wrong intrinsic to Jesus’ teaching. Even anger has a place.

He looked around at them in anger and, deeply distressed at their stubborn hearts, said to the man, “Stretch out your hand.” He stretched it out, and his hand was completely restored. (Mark 3:5 NIV)

“Do not suppose that I have come to bring peace to the earth. I did not come to bring peace, but a sword. (Matthew 10:34 NIV)

btw, this is not to say that I saw any sign of anger in Dor’s post, for I did not - we all make assumptions - some right some wrong - for example, I may be wrong to assume you are attempting to gain the high moral ground by your "peace and harmony" rebuke.

Indeed, until the return of Christ, peace will continue to come, at a cost...so will freedom to be...

pacifism gets one either dead, or enslaved...

v/r

Q

[taijasi]

Originally Posted by kenod

The "new age” philosophy of peace and harmony at all costs, does not fit comfortably within Christian beliefs. There is a clear right and wrong intrinsic to Jesus’ teaching. Even anger has a place.

Of course, you have chosen to focus on distinctions here, Kenod ... and I'm not sure "New Age" philosophy, as you put, emphasizes peace and harmony "at all costs." I think what many a New Ager might say, is that we could use more of it, but they would agree with the idea that in many situations, we should defend ourselves (!), both collectively and individually.

And since I am inclined to identify with "New Age" ideas, sometimes (most of which were ancient many thousands of years before Jesus was ever born) ... I'll make no exception now. To wit: Inasmuch as Jesus does teach a "clear right and wrong," anger - in the sense of what this word normally connotes - fits the into the LATTER category. Even that which is called "the Divine indignation," is something I think we poorly understand.

But for a hint, and for starters, to see the teachings of one of Humanity's Greatest ... distorted, misquoted, bent out of shape and essentially tailor-twisted to fit & justify our own actions, thinking & personally-comfortable sense of morality, including what is and isn't decent interpersonal behavior between people seeking to express LOVE ....

... ah yes. THAT is likely to give rise to a bit of righteous indignation. Getting angry, and upset, and pitching a general fit - as a child's temper tantrum - is unbecoming of ANY human. The notion that a Master such as Christ Jesus might carry on in such fashion ... is preposterous.

The sword which Christ brought is that which cuts, or divides, the real from the unreal, truth from falsity. It helps us to behold the proverbial wheat ... as distinct from the chaff on the threshing floor. Even some of our most treasured ideas and (mis-)interpretations, will be found among this chaff.

taijasa

[Dor]

Originally Posted by Marietta

Hello Dor,
You wrote:
"""I speak literally. Now that being said where I see God non-believers and corrupters may not see him or hear him or feel him. We each have our own personal interactions with him all it takes is belief and faith."""

Now, Now, no reason to be so nasty. Ego has no place in a discussion about the scriptures. Lets have a discussion in peace and harmony. Anger only brings distruction.

You are Loved, and that is what you should focus upon whcih will help you let go of the anger. Everything is ok and in God's Divine Right Order no matter how or who may challenge your belief system. Leave the Judging to the higher parts in the higher realms where things are seen more clearly. God allows for all expression and thoughs regarding what we perceive as reality.

With Love and Light, Midge

Sorry that was not nasty. I have been known to get rather nasty on these boards and it generally is when people try to twist stuff to fit their agenda.

I know I am loved and could care less if mankind accepts me. We are supposed to judge everything and I will,
the only thing we are not supposed to judge is someone's salvation.

[Dor]

Ok no anger and no judgement here.
I have 6 different translations of the bibles in my house and 7 more on my computer and they all say paraphrased that God made man and then made woman. Not a single one of the 1000's of people that translated any of them thought it said the Goddesses made an androgynous creature. God has convinced me that my bible is his word and I take him at his word.
I dont need to change it and I dont need to tear it apart to make me feel better about what it says.

Peace and harmony only works to a certain point. We are not supposed to just appease everyone as Kenod pointed out.
I was in the military I fought in a war so people had right to say what they want. I will always welcome opinions and everyones right to speak them. I will not always just say yes you are right. I will tell you when I do not agree with you.
I definately will not deny my beliefs in the bible and God to save face or make everyone feel good.

[Marietta]

Hello Kenod, Thank you for the response.
If what I have come to understand sounds new age to you, so be it but I am not new age and do not promote "Love, Light and Clueless ness." The ostridge can stick its head in the sand and still gets devoured by its predators.. However, I am of the mind that anger has no place and that peace and harmony are always for the best of all. What good does it benefit me to get angry and spread discord? This is the kind of thinking that brought about the inquisition and is what terrorism is built upon. Are you aware that more people have been killed in the name of religion than in all the major wars put together. During the inquisition alone over 5 million were killed. Once someone gets angry they shut down and when they attack the natural response of the one being attacked is to attack back and before you know it you have a full blown battle. When discussing the scriptures what good does a battle accomplish? The only thing that is learned from fighting is that it hurts, not only yourself but those with whom you are fighting.
Just look how it spreads, she has pulled you into her battle to fight for her. It doesn't take much thought to realize how anger is harmful and never brings a peaceful solution. A little leaven can spreads to the whole lump.

Simple logic tells you that anger is a destructive force. Jesus was a being of love and light and did not get angry.

In the Greek Mark 3:5 literally reads: 5. and glancing around at their anger, grieving over their blindness (a medical term meaning a thick skin over the eyes, probably cataracts). the heart of them remembering that they were human beings holding out their hands and holding the hands they were restored.

Jesus came among a group of angry people who were grieving over their blindness. They held out their hands to Jesus and Jesus took hold of their hands and healed them.

Matthew 10
34. denying the custom that go cut down peace on the earth don't beat down peace but the sword

Jesus denies taking away the piece and continues to say to take away the sword (not piece).

What good does anger (opposing love) bring?
Love and Light, Marietta

[Marietta]

Hello Dor, Apology accepted. Now lets continue in a discussion of Love and Light where we can both come away with more knowledge.

You are making to many judgments against me. I do not have an agenda of any kind. I am a true seeker of Divine truth plane and simple. I state what I have come to understand and listen to what others have come to understand or believe and assimilate what makes since and discard what doesn't plane and simple. If I had an agenda I would be the one getting upset but due to the fact that I don't have an agenda other than learning and sharing what I have come to understand, I don't take this personal.

Yes, we are supposed to judge everything however when you judge another person and do it inaccurately and promote it in a public forum you have also convicted that person and you do not have the right to do so.

You wrote:
"""the only thing we are not supposed to judge is someone's salvation."""

You judged my heart and implied that I am an unbeliever and a corrupter. It is the heart that determines our salvation and you judged my heart by a few simple statements on a message board.

However all is well and good and I love you all the same.
Love and Light, Midge

[Marietta]

Greetings Dor, Good to have a fresh start with the air cleared.

The number of bibles that you have access to does not make them correct, they are all simply translations. I personally have 21 translations of the bible and I have never counted how many I have on my computer. I used to be a collector and got my hands on every translation I could find. This does not negate the fact that a standard has been set for those who translated these text. They take the given meaning of a text and their translation has to follow the guidelines of what the text has come to mean. Hermeneutics were used to distort the true teachings of Christ. Hermeneutics was developed by Homer to twist the teachings of Plato. It is a means by which you can take the teachings about the gods and make it apply to whatever you want by simply adding a rule. This is why there are so many different churches with differing beliefs. However this wasn't only applied to interpretation of a given text, it was also applied to the ancient language. The church forbid anybody to speak the language of have copies of any literature in the ancient language. They went as far as to burn libraries to hide the real truth. The Hebrew speaking people were forbidden to speak the language and were forced to speak Greek. The NT was originally written in Hebrew/Aramaic and later translated into Greek. With nobody speaking or reading the original language over the years it was almost forgotten except in the closed circles of the Jews who kept it alive in hiding. Each time it was found that they still had some of this knowledge they were killed. The inquisition lasted for over 600 years while the church set up its new doctrine and anybody who opposed the teachings of the church were killed. People tried to make translations from hidden copies of the Hebrew text but when found the text was burned along with its translators. The church claimed to be totalitarian stating that only the pope could hear the voice of God and it was only the pope who could tell you what those scriptures said and meant. To this day he is called the Vicar.

You stated:
"""God has convinced me that my bible is his word and I take him at his word.
I dont need to change it and I dont need to tear it apart to make me feel better about what it says."""

Please believe me when I say that I never set out to tear the bible apart or change it.
Over the years I have come to realize some pretty amazing things. My heart, desire’s to know Divine Truth and to live a righteous life. I grieve daily for wisdom and knowledge, along with understanding, and stay in prayer at all times including when I am sleeping. I feel as if my heart sometimes will literally burst as I grieve to know Source's Divine Truth. Over the years I kept coming back to Genesis, which is where my learning started to take root, and is where my Spirit brought me to begin giving me understanding. You can’t pick up a book and start reading it in the middle or at the end, expecting to gain a solid understanding of what it is all about. I never started out with the thought in mind to study any particular subject or text I just wanted to know the truth about the Holy Scriptures in the form we call the Bible. Over thirty years ago I found myself praying daily for wisdom and knowledge along with understanding, also praying for the ability to discern spirits. I also, prayed that the Holy Spirit would empty my mind of anything that I had learned over the years that jaded my mind to pure knowledge, so my mind could process divine understanding acquiring wisdom. As I prayed this prayer my whole body would ache with grief longing for the ability to discern Divine Truth as given in the scriptures.
Spending a lot of time studying the Holy Scriptures I would find passages that didn’t fit what I had been taught. At first I was afraid to question what they were saying, due to my religious upbringing however, when I finally realized that I wasn’t questioning God, but was questioning man’s interpretation and translation of these scriptures, is when my Spirit started to open up beginning my learning process. I prayed that my mind would be opened to learning, and that as soon as my mind was open I asked that guardian angels be put around it, keeping any untruth from entering.
My prayer was and still is that my Spirit awakens enough to expand my mind, so that I can at least grasp a flash of this infinite wisdom
The Divine Laws of Creation in the form of the scriptures are so rich and chunky that it is easy to choke on them. There were times that I bit off more than I could chew and I almost choked. I became afraid, couldn’t sleep and doubt tried to creep in. Then the Holy Spirit opened my mind, so that I could digest what I was choking on and how very sweet was the taste of it.
Whenever the Spirit revel’s something opposing what I have already come to understand I panic and question weather it is a trick of the devil, however after praying with all my heart and with a lot of grief the Spirit always provides at least two witnesses that back up what I am seeing. There are always other passages in the Bible that back up what I have been shown. Line upon line, precept upon precept, here a little, there a little, this is how the Spirit reveals things.

You wrote:
""Peace and harmony only works to a certain point. We are not supposed to just appease everyone as Kenod pointed out.""



Peace and Harmony ALWAYS WORK FOR THE GOOD OF ALL. In all war only one side comes out a winner and nobody has a right to take the freedom of another away even if we disagree with it.
There is a very big difference in appeasing someone (which is merely agreeing with them for the sake of agreeing) and attacking someone to show your point. You can maintain a state of peace and harmony and at the same time get your point across. Sometimes it is good to agree to disagree and let it go. Nobody has a right to force their beliefs upon another.

Love is supreme and Love does not destroy, it uplifts and builds.

If nothing else I hope we come to understand where the other is coming from.

Love and Light, Marietta

[wil]

Originally Posted by Dor

...I have 6 different translations of the bibles in my house and 7 more on my computer and they all say paraphrased that God made man and then made woman....

tis the nice thing about the bible...no matter what your viewpoint you can find some such evidence...

Gen1:27 So God created man in his own image,
in the image of God he created him;
male and female he created them.

two versions of creation/Genesis two versions of Noah, was it pairs or 7 pairs...