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| Belief and Spirituality General thinking beyond the boundaries of religion and organised belief |
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#1 (permalink) | |
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Soul Rebel
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: The Highlands of Scotland
Posts: 4,604
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The Holy Fool (Fool II)
The subject of the True Fool has already been broached - but while searching for something from the Internet Book of Shadows on the corn-god, I found another interesting piece of writing on the subject of the Fool.
I'll paste it here, as it could be a very coule topic to continue the the subject of the Fool is a specific direction: Quote:
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#2 (permalink) | |
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Soul Rebel
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: The Highlands of Scotland
Posts: 4,604
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Continued...
Quote:
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#3 (permalink) |
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Moderator
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Interesting thought, but not everything is in 3s. Two primary aspects of deity (God/Goddess), 3 aspects of Goddess (Maiden/Mother/Crone) [and corresponding aspects of the God], but 4 quarters/directions/cross-quarters, 5 points on the pentacle/pentagram....
Numeric progressions have mystical importance in many cultures. Hmm - wonder if a rewrite of "Green Grow The Rushes Oh" has been done for that sequence yet? <g,d&r> |
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#4 (permalink) |
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Junior Member
Join Date: Jun 2003
Posts: 43
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Hmmm. I'd have to quibble about Doubting Thomas. In my particular church, he's been known to be protrayed as the archetypical engineer, requiring tangible proof of something before he'll believe. Of course, my church has a larger than average proportion of engineers, and I'm the daughter and sister of one. What I understand Christian trilogy, incorporating masculine, feminine and neuter aspects to be is the old-fashioned Trinity -- God (neuter), Christ (male), and the Holy Spirit, who I'm told traditionally uses the feminine gender, although she gets short shrift in English.
I'll also add to the list in the article and mention that in Japanese mythology, the fox, inari, is the trickster, and one who can be tricked. From a Christian perspective, in 1 Corinthians, Paul does some wonderful riffing on the idea of foolishness and wisdom and (I've got Bible Gateway open in another window to make sure I get my facts straight) claims that "We are fools for Christ." As someone who's been known to risk being incredibly foolish by doing things such as taking up fencing, etc., I like that idea. CJ |
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#5 (permalink) |
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Established member
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania, USA
Posts: 201
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Kirkegaard wrote about faith as a "blind leap into the darkness." For any of you who saw the third Indiana Jones movie--the one involving a search for the Holy Grail--there is a perfect metaphor there. Indie comes to a sheer cliff above a deep canyon, and realizes he needs to step off and trust the angels to support him. "Oh, great," he says. "It's a test of faith!" But he steps off anyway into seemingly empty air . . . and nearly falls when he steps onto a bridge painted so as to appear invisible from the vantage point of the step-off.
Speaking as one with a nastily scientific and questioning turn of mind, I still find that any philosophy of religion--including, to my way of thinking, atheism!--requires that blind and apparently foolish leap of faith. Currently, I'm writing a book about how magic is not only compatible with, but demanded by quantum physics . . . but even if I'm 100% right with my premise, my belief in a deity,or deities, still depends on my belief which cannot be quantified, and which cannot be hung from objective supports. I've always appreciated that "fools for Christ" line in I Corinthians, starting back when I was a fundie. So much of the Gospel story is so COMPLETELY contrary to what we are pleased to think is common sense and everyday experience. God loved the world so much He had His son incarnated as a human? That God-human died to square our sins with God? God raised him from the dead so we could have eternal life? Talk about foolish! But no more foolish, in the long run, than my belief that Deity pervades everyone and everything, that we can have meaningful dialogue with it, or that we can use magic to change our reality. And no more foolish, for that matter, than insisting that there is no Deity at all and that physical, material reality is all there is to us, to life, and to the universe. My current view emphasizes the spiritual walk rather than specific dogma. I no longer agree with Christian doctrine, but to my way of thinking it doesn't matter who's right and who's wrong. In fact, there IS no "right" or "wrong" in the question. What counts is what the individual believer believes, so my Wiccan path is right for me, and Christianity is right for Seige, and the point of this whole exercise is that we each learn from the spiritual path we have chosen--our individual "Fool's walk." It is, perhaps, needless for me to point out that the Major Arcana of the traditional Tarot has been viewed as the Fool's passage through life, his encounters and life-lessons, culminating at last in The World, representing completion and fullfillment--and also as the gate to the NEXT cycle of life and learning. So we're all fools, some of us more so than others! |
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#6 (permalink) |
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Soul Rebel
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: The Highlands of Scotland
Posts: 4,604
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Good points - and certainly sounds like an interesting book. And I'm sure you'll have plenty of interested buyers around here.
![]() The point about the Tarot - certainly a fascinating idea. An especially important point about the Fool figure, though, is that it is necessarily one of sacrifice. The "Hanged Man" card is an excellent illustration of the sacrificail principle of the Fool. Sometimes I wonder why the Fool and Hanged Man cards are even represented separately, as they are simply different aspects of the same thing. From my own personal perception, anyway. |
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#8 (permalink) |
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Where is the Love???
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Adolescence
Posts: 4,244
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Re: The Holy Fool (Fool II)
nah nah nah... This is bugging me I know it's old but what the hell is the first quote all aboot? It's half the size but twice as far away as what? lmao....
"A fork maybe good for spag bowl.... but a spoon is round!" WHAT!£$?!$? lol... |
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#11 (permalink) |
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Executive Member
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: liverpool, the 2008 winners of the capital of culture, england
Posts: 948
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Re: The Holy Fool (Fool II)
...interesting that you both align the fool with the hanged man... I can't agree at all...
in fact, I'd go so far as to say... nahhhh.... if we look at the symbolism of ae waites fool, we see? a young (naive?) person, blindly stepping over a precipice, and yet... this flaxen haired youth, with a white rose, symbolic of pure, or even spiritual love, has packed up his possessions, and sets out, alone, and yet... beside him is a little white dog... man's best friend... a loyal companion... the fool here is not conscious of his sacrifice, although maybe yes, the fool becomes the circumspect one who has overcome his trials later, but not here he isn't... this card is zero... this card is us, on the start of our spiritual quest... love, a real love, an earnest desire, a longing to unite with the muse, this is Zero's quest, and his folly... only time will tell whether he is upheld, aloft, given wings by love... |
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#14 (permalink) | |
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from far far away
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: oxfordshire
Posts: 701
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Re: The Holy Fool (Fool II)
oo oo, an interesting post i missed!
![]() as a bit of a fool/druid myself i would consider it as not located in anything. as a universalist i would not put god or the goddess outside of it, nor it outside of anything else. i think the three classifications represent it quite well, although in my opinion it should not be so divided. the foolish energy can be taken in many directions yet is not of any of them itself. Quote:
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#15 (permalink) | |
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Junior Member
Join Date: Mar 2006
Posts: 75
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Re: The Holy Fool (Fool II)
Quote:
I don't see the correspondence with the Hanged Man either, for whatever that's worth. But the rest of your description reminds me of someone I knew a long time ago. I was always absolutely sure that his card was the Fool, but I've never understood WHY I felt that way. I'm beginning to get an inkling of it now that I realize it's also my card, maybe not all the time but in certain moods. --Linda |
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