Sexism

[Geist]

You always hear women saying how men discrinate agains them but you never hear the men complaining about how women discriminate against them. I was watching tv today and I saw an add from this company:

http://www.diamond.co.uk/

If women expect sexism to stop how can you turn to a company that discriminates against male customers?

[brucegdc]

I'd say they're discriminating based on claim costs, more than gender. Over here in the US, the insurance rates are significantly different at most companies based on age and gender - nothing new there. It's an estimate of what it will cost to pay out claims ... (of course, if you've had an at-fault accident *wham* your insurance rates go through the roof.)

[Geist]

Originally Posted by brucegdc

I'd say they're discriminating based on claim costs, more than gender. Over here in the US, the insurance rates are significantly different at most companies based on age and gender - nothing new there. It's an estimate of what it will cost to pay out claims ... (of course, if you've had an at-fault accident *wham* your insurance rates go through the roof.)

Its the same in the U.K but how can women complain about discimination when they join comapinies that disciminate themselves?

[I, Brian]

It's not general social discrimination, as much as targeted marketing.

Marketing has to discriminate amongst consumer groups for targeting - seems this is just a particular example based on gender.

[Geist]

I was using it as an example not to base the whole debate apone..

[Vajradhara]

Namaste all,


it is an interesting phenomena, this market drive sexism, it is....

i've noted for the past several years a growing trend on American television, i wonder if beings in other parts of the world have noticed it as well.

for a single catch phrase, i call this phenomena the "incompetent male".

we some early instances of it with some television shows, like the Honeymooners and a bit later with shows like All in The Family. but, these were relatively few and far between.

recently, however, there is no shortage of television programming or advertising which seeks portray men as bumbling idiots who couldn't buy their own underwear if they didn't have help. whilst there is a good natured aspect to this humor (ultimately, from which is derived, in my view) the negative stereo-type does nothing to promote gender harmony.... personally, i feel that it actually harms it.

for some examples, i would direct the interested reader to some of the recent Verizon Cellular phone commercials. in this one scene, the father pathetically attempts to hug his daughters and wife after giving them cell phones, they laugh and walk away from him. he calls after them plaintively to "call" which they don't respond to and simply leave.

of course... commercials are always searching for the "breakthrough" factor, so to a certain extent you can expect that they will be provocative.

television shows, by contrast, (though money making schemes for the networks) are entertainment for the masses, as it were. it is here where young boys and girls will see how, in their minds, other beings behave and treat their gender and their opposite.

watching television shows where the father slaps the mother on the bum are no different than watching television shows where the mother emasculates the father though verbal humiliation. the lesson that the young learn is not a lesson of understanding, compassion and respect, it is, by contrast a lesson of exploitation and degradation.

which, i for one, am not pleased to see.

just some rambling grist going through the mill...

[Geist]

All well and good but how are you ment to stop it from happening?

[Quahom1]

Originally Posted by Geist

All well and good but how are you ment to stop it from happening?

By not playing the part as portrayed on TV or in the books or the magazines. If for example society (or the media's portrayal of society) expects someone to be a loser, simply refuse to accomodate their expectations.

Inspite of what we are seeing in the media, the world does love a winner. Especially if the winners "beat the odds", placed against them.

The quickest way I know of to peak curiosity, and to force questioning of one's perception of another is to not do what they expect you to do. For better or worse, the formula works. The first results are almost immediate.(confusion and observation) Lasting results come with repetitive displays that counter the first impression/expectation. (either a change in thinking, or a confirmation of the original opinion).

v/r

Q

[Geist]

I am as abnormal as they come and believe me it doesn't always work out good. Sometimes I wish I was the normal parsona of a teenager just so I can fit in.

[path_of_one]

Originally Posted by Geist

All well and good but how are you ment to stop it from happening?

Quit watching TV shows that do this and buying junk with crappy commercials.

Seriously. These shows and commercials are only there because they are generating revenue. The sure way to curb much of our social ills of this sort (and environmental degradation by corporations, human rights violations, etc.) is to become educated about our choices as consumers and investors and be willing to sacrifice what we feel like having for the greater good.

And I agree, V. As much as women are still often portrayed as sexual objects, men are often portrayed as buffoons. Neither of which is at all helpful in giving positive role models for equal and supportive gender relations. I think one of the most damaging stereotypes is that fathers are not nurturing, intelligent gaurdians of their children. They are so often portrayed as unfeeling or incompetant, and this doesn't encourage boys to grow up into good fathers.

And Geist, as another who has never fit in and eventually accepted I will never fit in, I feel your pain, as it were. I detested high school and wasn't very happy until I was in college and able to find others who were similarly odd. I still have no social group to which I belong, but I have picked up a few random understanding folks along the way that will listen to my ramblings and like my oddities, even if they don't understand them.

[lunamoth]

I watch a little TV, less and less as time goes by. I just can't stand the sexism, and outright sex and violence and just plain stupidity I see on TV, both shows and ads. Talk about your lowest common denominator. Along with the female sex objects (anyone else noticed the strong dominatrix themes much of the time?) and the male/father buffoons, there're also the kids who are so much more wise and mature than their parents. Ah well, I suppose if it wasn't pushing someone's buttons it wouldn't be entertainment.

I agree that the best thing to do is just turn it off, and stop buying.

However, now that I have two young daughters growing up fast, I am bracing myself for the clothes and attitudes of the day. I was kind of a tomboy/grunge type myself, but I can easily see my older daughter (only 5) being attracted to the Brittany look. She actually has quite a sense of style and color, clearly a natural talent, and I don't want to force her into my pathetic uniform mode of dressing (still in jeans, Tevos and t-shirts), but I can't stand the thought of her going to school in bare midriff and nanoskirts. Not that I would ever agree to her buying such stuff or letting her out of the house in it, but I only too well remember my own rebellious years...I can only hope that she will learn to appreciate the power in modest dress and attitude before we get there.

lunamoth

[Geist]

I don't watch that much TV anymore all I watch is:
Star Trek
My Family
and Anime
Sometimes the News

Originally Posted by path_of_one

fathers are not nurturing, intelligent gaurdians of their children. They are so often portrayed as unfeeling or incompetant, and this doesn't encourage boys to grow up into good fathers.

But really Fathers are not needed to bring up a child so whats the point of them even being there?

Originally Posted by path_of_one

Geist, as another who has never fit in and eventually accepted I will never fit in, I feel your pain

I cause lots of arguments.

Originally Posted by lunamoth

However, now that I have two young daughters growing up fast, I am bracing myself for the clothes and attitudes of the day. I was kind of a tomboy/grunge type myself, but I can easily see my older daughter (only 5) being attracted to the Brittany look.

Better than the depressing Gothic thing. However if you think they are growing up so fast they're going to be running circles around you when they hit teenage years XD.

[Quahom1]

Originally Posted by Geist

I don't watch that much TV anymore all I watch is:
Star Trek
My Family
and Anime
Sometimes the News


But really Fathers are not needed to bring up a child so whats the point of them even being there?

"In a Pig's eye..." quote by Quahom

Star Trek is a good start.

You know, your offhanded insults are really beginning to become annoying. I suggest you Grow Up Young Lady.

This FATHER sends.

Q

[brucegdc]

I'm not sure, Quahom, but I think (based on the start of this thread) that Geist is male... and having gone through a few rounds of custody here, one could certainly get the impression that many folks believe fathers aren't needed... an impression reinforced by some of the TV portrayals...

... Bruce

[Quahom1]

Originally Posted by brucegdc

I'm not sure, Quahom, but I think (based on the start of this thread) that Geist is male... and having gone through a few rounds of custody here, one could certainly get the impression that many folks believe fathers aren't needed... an impression reinforced by some of the TV portrayals...

... Bruce

Male/female...rude is rude. We're tyring to be nice and this person seems to enjoy throwing it back in our faces.

We are not TV portrayals. This isn't "slap hands", you lose.

But you are right, this isn't worth my time, and I should not be getting upset.

v/r

Q