Seatbelts

[Bandit]

How do you guys & girls feel about the seatbelt laws?

For me, I think it should be taught & used, but it should not be a law. From what I hear, it is even tougher in Europe.

I am definately in for child restraint & seatbelt used as law when children are riding. I am also up for helmet law on motorcycles.
I dont have a problem with wearing the seatbelt, I just have some problems with it being a law where people are punished, especially when I research & recall how it came to be a law & differently in each state as to how the government went about enforcing it.

What are some of the pros & cons with it?
Do you always buckle up?

[I, Brian]

No problems with seatbelt laws here in the UK - and as someone recently pointed out, it's not there because the law thinks I'm a bad driver, but because it knows there are other bad drivers out there.

Then again, the US has a very different mentality, especially in terms of individual freedom of choice. Is there seatbelt legislation under discussion in the review in the US at the moment?

[Bandit]

Originally Posted by I, Brian

No problems with seatbelt laws here in the UK - and as someone recently pointed out, it's not there because the law thinks I'm a bad driver, but because it knows there are other bad drivers out there.

Then again, the US has a very different mentality, especially in terms of individual freedom of choice. Is there seatbelt legislation under discussion in the review in the US at the moment?

If there is it would be done state by state. Depending on what state you are in is how bad the offense is considered. Like here where I live, it is a secondary offense where they only ticket after another violation. In the North Carolina, they can stop someone & hammer out the tickets just for not wearing it- sort of like people are criminals. I remember NC was a big testing area for it in the beginning (mid 80s). Real tough there.
Some states even apply points to the driver along with a hefty fine for no seat belt, which stays on the record for a long time & the driving privilage can be suspended. That is not right IMO.

The biggest argument I think is, Government telling people what they should do for safety, (as a health issue), when the truth is it may or may not make it safer. They seem to avoid the deaths & injuries caused by seatbelts, while I know over all, I think it helps more than hinders.
The other one is, No one can predict what may or may not happen in an accident.

The whole auto industry changed in the mid 80s & they did not want the seat belt thing to be pushed on them either.

I think it has been in effect long enough, that the generation born under the law does not even question how or some of the reasons it became law.
They kind of just preach wear it because it saves lives.

The part I dont really get, is where we have punishable seatbelt law, then you see 5 men riding in the back of a dump truck & no law for helmet on a motorcycle which I feel is more dangerous.

[path_of_one]

I'm all for seatbelt laws. In a part of the country where traffic is often extreme (nearly bumper to bumper and going 70+ mph), I want people attached to their vehicles. Granted, I see that it is not nearly so necessary when I'm out with ranchers on dirt roads in cow country. Of course, no one is enforcing anything there, so you can ride on top of the roof if you so desire.

If people don't have enough self-value of their own lives (and those of their families, who depend on them to stay alive), then at least they can be bound by the law to not encroach on my life. When two vehicles have a head-on collision and somebody isn't wearing a seatbelt, the odds are not bad that one of those bodies is going to fly out their front windshield and hit my vehicle. I do not want to deal with bodies flying all over the place, as it is both dangerous and psychologically traumatic. It isn't just about personal safety, in my opinion, it's also about respect for those motorists around you and their safety and mental health. Think about what you'd go through if you had your kids in the car witness an accident in which people flew out of the vehicle and died on the pavement in front of them. Because it happens, and it's not pretty. Personally, I'm grateful it's law. I see enough people break the law even with it being strictly enforced here in So Cal. The worst offenders I've seen are, oddly enough, people with a bunch of kids in mini-vans. For some reason, these folks think that their van has some magical protection system that a car or truck doesn't, and that their precious cargo will not be seriously injured or killed if they get in an accident (which they're likely to do, since they're often talking on a cell phone at the same time). People- the mini-vans aren't magic- your kid can get thrown out of any of its many windows and/or be tossed like a rag-doll within it if you are in an accident. BUCKLE UP.

[InLove]

I feel much safer when I "click it". I may arrive at my destination with a few more wrinkles in my clothing, but at least I have a better chance of arriving there in one piece.

I was kind of relieved when the seatbelt laws were put into effect--then I could take that sign down off my dashboard that said "No seatbelt? No ride!".

InPeace,
InLove

[Phyllis Sidhe_Uaine]

I "click it" because my dad used to refuse to start the engine (used to say that his car had paranormal abilities [it would know when someone wasn't buckled in and would refuse to start.])

Both he and I survived accidents by "buckling up" (he was in a four car accident in 1973 that totalled the car [engine block was resting right next to him in the passenger compartment] and he only received minor injuries to his legs, I was in an accident a decade later [the passenger in the car my brother drove] and I received a minor concussion and a fractured left hip [I would've ended up run over by the other driver's car if I wasn't buckled in.])

Quite a few kids at school think I'm crazy for requesting that they buckle up when I use the van service that the university provides for faculty/staff/students, but after spending time on a stretcher in the emergency room, I think I have the voice of experience behind me on this (plus I feel it's important for them to reach my age, especially for their parents.)

Phyllis Sidhe_Uaine

[Faithfulservant]

I looked at it as one of the first laws in my lifetime of many that infringe on our rights.. Now they can pull you over if they see you without your seatbelt on.. it used to be secondary now it is a reason to pull you over to ticket you. The thing is.. its your word against theirs.. if they tell you that you didnt have it on and you say "officer I had my seatbelt on" who is the judge going to believe. Theres no trust in our system.. your guilty until proven innocent and its very frustrating to me. It goes the other way too.. The criminals have more rights than the victims.. They just found out that 5 states were giving Viagra and other impotency drugs to sex offenders using through medicaid.. so basically sex offenders were getting sex drugs using OUR money. So now what do they do.. Medicaid will no longer cover those drugs for people who actually need them.

Very frustrating

[Bandit]

Originally Posted by InLove

I feel much safer when I "click it". I may arrive at my destination with a few more wrinkles in my clothing, but at least I have a better chance of arriving there in one piece.

I was kind of relieved when the seatbelt laws were put into effect--then I could take that sign down off my dashboard that said "No seatbelt? No ride!".

InPeace,
InLove

yah, that is another thing...seatbelts & nice clothes, especially.
i guess it will depend on how far we are travelling together, because there is no way I am keeping it on the whole trip from here to Florida. LOL
so i guess i will be hitch hiking after about two hours. (tease)

[Bandit]

Originally Posted by Phyllis Sidhe_Uaine

I "click it" because my dad used to refuse to start the engine (used to say that his car had paranormal abilities [it would know when someone wasn't buckled in and would refuse to start.])

Both he and I survived accidents by "buckling up" (he was in a four car accident in 1973 that totalled the car [engine block was resting right next to him in the passenger compartment] and he only received minor injuries to his legs, I was in an accident a decade later [the passenger in the car my brother drove] and I received a minor concussion and a fractured left hip [I would've ended up run over by the other driver's car if I wasn't buckled in.])

Quite a few kids at school think I'm crazy for requesting that they buckle up when I use the van service that the university provides for faculty/staff/students, but after spending time on a stretcher in the emergency room, I think I have the voice of experience behind me on this (plus I feel it's important for them to reach my age, especially for their parents.)

Phyllis Sidhe_Uaine

I am glad you & your dad were buckled up too. I think it is good to remind the kids to buckle up...shows you care & they will remember that later.

Now I was in a wreck where my perfect 1981 Pontiac Grand Prix was totalled, where the impact came from the side & back right. It was only about 35 MPH side impact.
It knocked my head so hard against the driver window, then i came completely out of the seat belt shoulder strap & my legs were twisted up in the lap part of the belt while I was half sitting in the passenger seat & middle console. It was awful. Bad Headaches for months & a couple of broken ribs. I felt more sad for the car than me.
so from a side impact the belt will do little to nothing to help. It surely will keep one from going through the windshield but the belt does not stop an object from coming through the windshield.
Like when my trucker friend had a load in front of him lose the metal poles & one came through the windshield, knocking every one of his teeth out & scaring his face forever.

[Bandit]

Originally Posted by Faithfulservant

I looked at it as one of the first laws in my lifetime of many that infringe on our rights.. Now they can pull you over if they see you without your seatbelt on.. it used to be secondary now it is a reason to pull you over to ticket you. The thing is.. its your word against theirs.. if they tell you that you didnt have it on and you say "officer I had my seatbelt on" who is the judge going to believe. Theres no trust in our system.. your guilty until proven innocent and its very frustrating to me. It goes the other way too.. The criminals have more rights than the victims.. They just found out that 5 states were giving Viagra and other impotency drugs to sex offenders using through medicaid.. so basically sex offenders were getting sex drugs using OUR money. So now what do they do.. Medicaid will no longer cover those drugs for people who actually need them.

Very frustrating

I felt the same way about it infinging on rights. Especially the way they paid certain states & senators to enforce it as a law when they did not want to.
It is still a secondary here but some states it is a first & actually give it a misdemeanor & that is not right.
I felt it was one of the first steps to test the public to see how far & how fast certain rights could be pushed.

I will never forget the episode a few years ago on 60 minutes, where it showed all those people who were injured by the seat belt or where it did nothing for safety. Especially that one young lady in the car on fire, who could not get out of the belt because it would not release & she burned half way before help got there.
This is some of why I feel it should not be a law & I go 50/50 with it.

I saw that on Viagara too & that is messed up. It is supposed to cause a type of blindness also. It is frustrating.

[Bandit]

Originally Posted by path_of_one

I'm all for seatbelt laws. In a part of the country where traffic is often extreme (nearly bumper to bumper and going 70+ mph), I want people attached to their vehicles. Granted, I see that it is not nearly so necessary when I'm out with ranchers on dirt roads in cow country. Of course, no one is enforcing anything there, so you can ride on top of the roof if you so desire.

If people don't have enough self-value of their own lives (and those of their families, who depend on them to stay alive), then at least they can be bound by the law to not encroach on my life. When two vehicles have a head-on collision and somebody isn't wearing a seatbelt, the odds are not bad that one of those bodies is going to fly out their front windshield and hit my vehicle. I do not want to deal with bodies flying all over the place, as it is both dangerous and psychologically traumatic. It isn't just about personal safety, in my opinion, it's also about respect for those motorists around you and their safety and mental health. Think about what you'd go through if you had your kids in the car witness an accident in which people flew out of the vehicle and died on the pavement in front of them. Because it happens, and it's not pretty. Personally, I'm grateful it's law. I see enough people break the law even with it being strictly enforced here in So Cal. The worst offenders I've seen are, oddly enough, people with a bunch of kids in mini-vans. For some reason, these folks think that their van has some magical protection system that a car or truck doesn't, and that their precious cargo will not be seriously injured or killed if they get in an accident (which they're likely to do, since they're often talking on a cell phone at the same time). People- the mini-vans aren't magic- your kid can get thrown out of any of its many windows and/or be tossed like a rag-doll within it if you are in an accident. BUCKLE UP.

I have seen them come flying out of windows too & the whole machine roll & roll & roll. but you know there may be times when getting thrown out would be better, than say rolling with the car not knowing what will finish it off.
I have to agree, the mini vans & the kids is not a good thing like that jumping around, hanging out the windows. Over all they will be safer belted in.

I think the cell phone thing should be a pull over & talk law...even when I see them with just the ear & microphone piece...people are thinking about other things instead of focusing on the road. That is a big problem for sure today.

Wearing my seat belt has honestly never made me feel safer because there are too many possiblities, with the exception of not going through the windshield. I guess that is just me though. Fortunately & thankfully I have not had too many wrecks.
I love offroading too, with no seat belt

[path_of_one]

I bet a lot of this is based on people's personal experiences. Years ago my mother and sister were in a ten-car wreck on the freeway- all the cars hydroplaned when they hit an unexpected puddle of oil and water. My mom's truck rolled three times, and cars were flying everywhere. My mom says she knows without a doubt if they hadn't been buckled in, they would have been thrown out of the truck and hit by other cars. Because they were, they got out with only minor scratches, even though the truck landed on its side. My best friend in our senior year of high school got in a wreck in the mountains where she flipped the car end over end a couple times and it flew head-first into a boulder. She was wearing her seatbelt as well. The force of the final collision was so bad it ripped the metal of the bottom of the car and her seat came loose. She's parapalegic because of the seat coming loose, but would have gone right through the windshield into the rock without the seatbelt.

I know of instances where the seatbelt traps people in a burning car, but I think these are few and far between (at least in my experience) compared to the many, many collisions I've seen. Of course, I live in an area where you are highly likely to be in an accident every so often due to the high population. I also know that in a minor accident, the seatbelt can break ribs and do some bad bruising. I'll take that chance- it's better than the chance of getting thrown out of my truck, in my estimation.

When I'm out on the ranches I don't worry about the seatbelt. There's nothing to run into. There's no traffic, few rocks and trees... I guess I could have a head-on collision with a cow, but since the cows and I tend to be going rather slowly, it's an unlikely event.

[Phyllis Sidhe_Uaine]

Originally posted by path_of_one
When I'm out on the ranches I don't worry about the seatbelt. There's nothing to run into. There's no traffic, few rocks and trees... I guess I could have a head-on collision with a cow, but since the cows and I tend to be going rather slowly, it's an unlikely event.

I've had friends/acquaintances who've lost "arguments" with deer while they (the drivers) were going rather slow, plus one time my mother and I came face to face with a deer in Milwaukee (right outside a hospital that we were going by.) Deer are more common than you think, and (during the rut) they don't care what's in their way, including roads, traffic, ranches...

Phyllis Sidhe_Uaine

[Bandit]

i know. i know. buckle up. click it or ticket. ITS THE LAW.

thanks for all the replies everyone. i do appreciate it & seeing how others feel about it. we did this awhile back at one of my car clubs & i think the poll came out to about 50% in favor of the law & the rest not in favor of the law & some did not care either way.

Not sure what the stats are currently for those who wear them, but I think New Hampshire is the only state left that still may not have made it a law.

most agreed, we should wear our seat belts.