Radical revision of Islamic texts

[Snoopy]

"Turkey is preparing to publish a document that represents a revolutionary reinterpretation of Islam - and a controversial and radical modernisation of the religion.
The country's powerful Department of Religious Affairs has commissioned a team of theologians at Ankara University to carry out a fundamental revision of the Hadith, the second most sacred text in Islam after the Koran."

- BBC NEWS | World | Europe | Turkey in radical revision of Islamic texts

...so...what do you think?

s.

[farhan]

Ijtihaad....nice thing I would say....if done by respectable/credible scholars.... & no western cabal suspected .

The problem with this is what an 18th century scholar said," Ijtihaad in the time of choas creates more choas". When he said this, muslims were in chaos, & they arnt out of it yet. So I really dont know what to expect.

Atleast this will bring Sharia to the 21st century.

[bananabrain]

Originally Posted by farhan

& no western cabal suspected

it's a bit sad that muslims are so keen to see "western cabals" behind any form of positive change. i mean, guys, come on. give it a chance to work.

b'shalom

bananabrain

[Muslimwoman]

It certainly gets my full support but unfortunately because it is being done just inside Turkey it will be rejected outside (Turkey has no respect in the Middle East). It would have been better to get a group of respected scholars from around the world and then it could over time be embraced.

Inshallah it is a small step in the right direction and perhaps others will follow suit.

Isn't it terrible that later conservative interpretations tke precidence over earlier ones. That is like me writing something about WWII history and it being taken more seriously than anything written by eye witnesses at the time. (I am shaking my head as I type - as my husband says, it is driven by tradition and culture)

[bananabrain]

so, do you think there's any chance that the turks might embarrass some other people into bringing out their own codes in competition? that might work - certainly in judaism one code tended to follow, enhance and update another.

b'shalom

bananabrain

[Muslimwoman]

As far as Muslims in general and Quran thumpers go I would say it will be rejected as heretical at first, without even considering their findings but given time, if it proves to be workable in Turkey and not erode the moral fabric then over time people may begin to take a look.

Interestingly I am currently trying to find out more about this project, which began in 2002:

Understanding-Islam.org - History of the Qur'an Project

it is quite fascinating if you get time to have a look. It would suggest the Turks are not the only people currntly asking questions which are normally seen as blasphemous. I need to find out which scholars are involved in the project before I can make an educated guess as to whether their findings could be taken seriously. It is all good stuff though and a move in the right direction.

Salaam
Sally

[wil]

Originally Posted by Muslimwoman

As far as Muslims in general and Quran thumpers go I would say it will be rejected as heretical at first, without even considering their findings but given time, if it proves to be workable in Turkey and not erode the moral fabric then over time people may begin to take a look.

Can you imagine the furor over the King James Version of the bible? I'd have loved to read the op ed pieces then! Yes folks look down their noses at the results of the Jesus Seminar, time will tell they say, but in these cases when we say time we mean centuries....

[Lecter]

I'm sorry but this sounds as if there was never any Ijtihad done before. Islam is a religion that contains the mechanism of change within itself, it does not need 'reformation', because it has always been doing it.

I'd advice you to read about the works of Muhammad Abdou for example.

We have a lot of respected scholars that I think we should know more about

[Muslimwoman]

Originally Posted by wil

but in these cases when we say time we mean centuries....

I wasn't brave enough to say a time limit but think you are spot on.

Originally Posted by Lecter

I'm sorry but this sounds as if there was never any Ijtihad done before. Islam is a religion that contains the mechanism of change within itself, it does not need 'reformation', because it has always been doing it.

but many taditional scholars stated that the gates of Ijtihad were closed in the 9th century and every question that could ever be asked had been asked. So for many people the mechanism for change that is built into Islam ground to a halt in the 9th century.

Originally Posted by Lecter

I'd advice you to read about the works of Muhammad Abdou for example.

We have a lot of respected scholars that I think we should know more about

I agree we have some wonderful scholars and ones that will not try to hide the truth in order to maintain their positions but for your average person on the street it is not so easy to decide which are the scholars to follow.

Personally I am a huge fan of Sheikh Sharawi (may Allah be pleased with him) and find his views to be Islamically sound and yet moderate in most cases. But I can also point to numerous schlars that state that it is better to follow a weak hadith than use our own judgement - that does not suggest a mechanism for change.

[Lecter]

Originally Posted by Muslimwoman

I agree we have some wonderful scholars and ones that will not try to hide the truth in order to maintain their positions but for your average person on the street it is not so easy to decide which are the scholars to follow.

But the thing about Islam is that we do allow difference of opinion when it comes to certain subjects. I mean all Muslims agree on the most important fundamentals of our religion, like Allah is one, belief in the messengers etc...

So I think it is up for us to decide which opinion we want to follow based on the intention of pleasing God in our hearts

Personally I am a huge fan of Sheikh Sharawi (may Allah be pleased with him) and find his views to be Islamically sound and yet moderate in most cases. But I can also point to numerous schlars that state that it is better to follow a weak hadith than use our own judgement - that does not suggest a mechanism for change.

Oh I love him. One of his books which we had to read in school is one of the major reasons I am so strong in my Iman.

Till this day I still watch his recorded programs on TV. The great thing about him is that he is talking in a language that people on the street can understand and appreciate.

[Muslimwoman]

Originally Posted by Lecter

So I think it is up for us to decide which opinion we want to follow based on the intention of pleasing God in our hearts

I agree with you completely, it just worries me that if a young person only has access to certain scholars then their choice of who to follow is very limited and I believe this is where young people become radicalised.

Originally Posted by Lecter

Till this day I still watch his recorded programs on TV. The great thing about him is that he is talking in a language that people on the street can understand and appreciate.

I love to watch him, even though I do not speak enough Arabic to understand him, it is just the way he talks to people and as you say in a language that anyone can understand (my husband translates for me sometimes). His body language suggests that he never looked down on anyone and simply wanted to spread his knowledge.

My favourite story about him was when he flew to Sharm to open a new mosque and at the airport he refused to get off the plane, saying "this place is hell and I will not be tempted by it". I admire him so much for that.

[Muslimwoman]

Perhaps not such a radical revision after all?

Islamtoday.Com

[Amica]

Salaam/peace,
I had lived in ex-Yugoslavia where religious texts/lectures were certainly censored and discouraged, but I never witnessed people pay so much attention to the Hadith.

Perhaps it is bad they did not, but I felt that people were rather focused more on the Qur'an (at least the generation of my grandparents who kept the faith). The Hadiths that I had heard of were usually the Hadith Qudsi, the most beatiful ones that give people hope and good advice in certain matters.

I do think that the collection of the Hadith does need to be revisited because certain hadiths contradict the Holy Qur'an. Those of Muslims who say that the hadiths certainly do not contradict the Holy Qur'an at all, they need to seriously ask themselves are they looking for excuses for certain behaviors which Qur'an never mentions (i.e. stoning as a punishment) and would rather follow the Hadith vs. The Noble Qur'an.

I personally respect the Hadith collectors, because I think they had good in mind. I use what is good from them and follow from the hadiths that which is positive and in line with the Qur'an (as much as possible, I do).

[bananabrain]

amica,

i am hugely encouraged by your position. can i recommend some further reading - and to others of you that are interested in the future of islam and its evolution to become at one with modernity rather than in conflict with it; but also without throwing out the "baby with the bath water" as has happened so many times with reforms:

"islam and liberty" by muhammad charfi (tunisian ex-minister of education)
"the Qur'an: a user's guide" by farid esack (south african theologian and prof. of divinity at harvard)

b'shalom

bananabrain

[Tao_Equus]

One thing I do find encouraging in the Turkish approach is to include the women. I think if this works in Turkey it is through the example the women set that it can find roots over a wider area. I wish them every success.

Tao