Past Lives

[WHKeith]

Great information there, Brian.

Remember the books I recommended a while back by Newton—“Destiny of Souls” and “Journey of Souls?” I’m not shilling his books . . . but they have a LOT of information on the soul group concept, if you’re interested.

In my experience, an intense interest in a particular historical period or venue is often THE indication that you’ve had some connection there in another life. I mentioned earlier that I’d done a lot of research on medieval Japan for a book long before I became interested in reincarnation . . . but *why did I choose to introduce Japanese culture to that book?* It turned out to be a direct portal for me to examine Japanese thought, philosophy, language, and history. Why not . . . I don’t know. China. Persia. Scandinavia. Or ancient Rome.

Something happened to me just last night that has a bearing on the soul-group idea. This wasn’t a case of soul groups, per se, but of overlap on the time line. I was at a party thrown by another coven. A young woman was there, not a coven member, but very open to the Craft and our weird ideas. I started giving her a backrub, which was both much appreciated and which seemed to drop her rapidly into an altered state.

While I was rubbing her back, she began telling me what she was seeing in her mind’s eye, which turned out to be her as a Native American warrior sitting down with other Indians and Frenchmen to plan a war against the English. That and other internal clues suggested that she was “remembering” a time of about 1753 or so, the beginning of what we over in the Colonies refer to as the French and Indian War. She gave me a LOT of detail—what she was wearing, what her face paint was like, and so on, which led me to suspect she was Iroquois, though she claims never to have studied Native American cultures or that historical period.

Now, what was cool about this is that I have never told her about one of MY remembered past lives. This was a regression I did for myself after having a particularly vivid dream about a year ago . . . and assumed was my imagination until I serendipitously came across a confirmatory historical article in a newspaper.

If my “imaginings” were correct, I was a medicine-worker of the Lene Lenape, a tribe the whites call Delaware. What didn’t make sense is that, in the dream, I knew I was Lene Lenape, but I was living west of the Ohio River—somewhere in what is now eastern Ohio—and NOT in the Delaware River Valley, which was the Lene Lenape homeland. The essence of the dream was that I had made a long journey, on foot and by canoe, to a White town at a river confluence to demand redress of certain grievances. There, I was treated nicely, and I and my one companion were given some beautiful blankets to take back to my tribe as gifts. Connected with that was a feeling of terrible fear, guilt, and grief.

Only later did I learn that, 1., the Lene Lenape were forced to leave the Delaware Valley in the 1600s and ended up living in eastern Ohio, mingled with another tribe—except for one branch that moved to western Canada; and, 2., that in 1762 or so, two Lene Lenape leaders traveled to Fort Pitt—where Pittsburgh is today at the confluence of the Allegheny, Monongahela, and Ohio Rivers—where they were given promises and a load of blankets—fresh from the infirmary where a number of Whites were down with smallpox. A large number of Lene Lenape and other Indians died as a result—an early instance of the deliberate use of germ warfare. The incident was one of the direct causes of Pontiac’s Rebellion in 1763, a short-lived Indian uprising from Detroit to Pittsburgh that pretty much ended their autonomy in the east.

I found the dream and regression fascinating because I am, in fact, part Choctaw—an Indian tribe from the south-Gulf area of the United States—and have long been drawn to Native American culture.

What was fascinating last night was to have this woman whom I’ve only known a short time and with whom I’ve NOT shared anything deep begin describing to me her life as a Native American in the mid-1700s, unbidden and without prompting from me. The tribes are different and separated by about 500 miles; the two Indians concerned would never have known one another. And yet there was some—call it a sympathetic vibration, if you will, which, as she relaxed under my hands triggered a full-blown past life regression.

Fascinating!

[Elizabeth May]

Thanks for the info, Bill! It must be quite amazing to have an extended sense of identity. After all, people seem generally insecure about identity, or so I figure with the big interests in family tree research, ethnic roots, and general research into human history. It's like we always have to have an idea of where we've come from to feel secure about moving forward. Maybe that's what the past life thing is, in that you're moving on. I'm not quite sure what I mean by that but I hope you do!
Self-hypnosis doesn't sound too bad. Maybe I should try that. I don't mind being deluded as long as no one else is pulling the chain! No idea what I'll get but maybe I'll get nothing.
I've thought about it before and wondered if you get new souls and stuff coming into being and livnig. Its hard to find the right ways to explain, but I figure I mean that there are people who have lived through millions of past lives and there's some who've only just started. Maybe I'm new. Or maybe it's not important for me to know. Does that mean I don't need to move on or I already have? Something for me to think about!

[WHKeith]

Does that mean I don't need to move on or I already have? Something for me to think about!

And that, of course, is part of what this board is all about! Self-reflection may be THE distinguishing feature between us and animals. Who am I, really? What do I believe, really? Why is that important, really? Not caring about what anybody else thinks, but wanting to klnow yourself, deep down and truly . . . that is when religion, in whatver form, stops being a goal in and of itself, and becomes a gateway to a deeper understanding of self, and to a new, higher, and more enlightened level of being.

[Damn, that sounds pretentious! Sorry 'bout that. But I mean it, sincerely, and don't know how else to say it! :- ]

Elizabeth, there is a book on the shelves now called "New Age Hypnosis". It does a good job of dispelling the nonsense and myth that surrounds the topic of hypnosis, talks about what you can learn, and gives exercises to try both with another and on your own.

As for the new souls/old souls bit, I can confirm that there are folks here who have been here MANY times before, and others (MANY others!) who are on their first or first-few go-rounds. Which is which? It's generally pointless to try to work up a formula--"Oh! You have X, Y, and Z! You must be an old soul!" Nonsense. And the very information, for many, can be self-limiting . . . kind of like telling a first-grader that, now that he can read, he knows all there is to know and doesn't need to learn another thing!

In general, souls come to recognize what they need to know about their own state when they need the information. A few hints, though. while not a universal constant, some clues to old-codgerishness of the soul are:

1. Self-reflection--the ability to introspectively examine one's self in terms of spiritual path and strength of purpose.

2. Tolerance--the understanding that other spiritual paths are as valid as one's own, and that the point is the journey, not the destination.

3. Love--it's a cliche, yeah, but the ability to love, show love, and ACCEPT love from others is key. I am, of course, referring to agape here, not eros or phileos. Accepting, unconditional only-a-mother-could-do-it love of one's fellow travellers.

[Vajradhara]

Originally Posted by brian

I wouldn't necessarily subscribe to a karmic belief in this process either - that of "souls" evolving through more complex life-forms, as that comes dangerously close to impinging cultural constructs of morality onto the mechanics of the universe - though some would disagree and insist that moral constructs would be an indispensable part of the mechanics of Divinity. Personally, I'd suggest the ability to enjoy the human experience is not necessarily more morally correct than, say, spending a few hours as a hatchling turtle, drawn towards the bright moon over the sea - only to be suddenly cracked open and devoured by some passing bird. Where would the opportunity for karmic mechanics to act there?

Namaste Brian,

you are doubtlessly aware that this is the specific Buddhist position on this issue karma is, indeed, the cause of our current life and our past lives for that matter. in order to understand what this really means, it's important to keep in mind the world view of the Buddhist, for it is vastly different than that of the average Western point of view.

generally speaking, the Western point of view is that of a mechanistic universe, one that is created, either by a Creator or a natural process (BB Theory) and that, by extension, everything else is created and created with a purpose.

by way of contrast, the other two competing world views, that is the Indian and Chinese. the Indian view is that Brahma, as the Supreme Omnipotent God is basically bored. to alleviate this boredom, Brahma causes himself to sleep and whilst asleep, to dream. this dream is so real to Brahma that he can experience the mystery and unexpectedness of life on earth. we are, and by extension everything else, manifestations of His dream mind... everything is a drama for Brahma and as such, we shouldn't attach to much to anything.

the Chinese view is called "Li" and it basically means "organic pattern". Li is typically defined as the markings in jade, the grain in wood, the sinew in muscle. it's observed as the foam rises from the surf on the beach, the clouds form and drift in the sky... there is a pattern to things, an order, but it is so subtle that you cannot put your finger on it.

so.. the Buddhist position is one that is typcially Indian or Chinese, depending on the Buddhism that you practice.

karma is the moral law of cause and effect in the universe, however it's workings are so vast and complex, that we cannot fathom them completely, enlightened beings can, however.

the ability to completely and totally recall past lives is something that can be attained within the Buddhist paradigm. technically, it's what happens when you reach the 7th Bodhisattva Gound (that's a vastly technical term and i'm afraid that i cannot explain it here.).

*looks back at the typing and wonders if it's on point*

[I, Brian]

Is it a specifically Buddhist perception? I had thought it was a distinctly Hindu concept first - though there is great room for error here, though, for myself

The problem I have is one of relativistic morality. For myself this is no simple rationalisation. I had what some may call a "Near Death Experience" when I was 18. It is utterly impossible to explain, but I have included something approaching a "description" in my first "Chronicles of Empire - which is still unpublished, but I'm on the right path.
Point being, during that experience (the magnitude of which is beyond normal comprehension) I experienced a "place" - or, better still, a "state of being" - which was shared by every other consciousness that has, does, and ever will exist. Without going into details (which I reserve strictly for the Chronicles account, namely because of the inherent difficulty in "describing" it to any satisfactory degree) I experienced no sense of morality.

In fact, the opposite was true - every action, no matter what the moral term of reference, has a constructive and necessary purpose. I'm aware that I'm on uncertain philosophical grounds here - essentially, it's arguing that everything has purpose, whether we are aware of that purpose or not.

So, in effect, "evil" per se, and immoral action in general, is not only a natural part of human behaviour, within the natural mechanics of the universe – but that they also serve a purpose.

(I'll try to start another thread about that specific issue. There's also the danger of touching upon the Free Will vs Determinism debate, which we most definitely should keep on another thread!)

How this relates to past lives – I have difficulty accepting a view (for myself) of a "moral engine" behind the process of reincarnation, namely because I cannot see a process of "Absolute Morality" at work at the human or sociological level at all.

Of course, there is also the very real possibility that I have an improper and flawed view of Karma.

[Vajradhara]

Originally Posted by I, Brian

In fact, the opposite was true - every action, no matter what the moral term of reference, has a constructive and necessary purpose. I'm aware that I'm on uncertain philosophical grounds here - essentially, it's arguing that everything has purpose, whether we are aware of that purpose or not.

So, in effect, "evil" per se, and immoral action in general, is not only a natural part of human behaviour, within the natural mechanics of the universe – but that they also serve a purpose.

(I'll try to start another thread about that specific issue. There's also the danger of touching upon the Free Will vs Determinism debate, which we most definitely should keep on another thread!)

How this relates to past lives – I have difficulty accepting a view (for myself) of a "moral engine" behind the process of reincarnation, namely because I cannot see a process of "Absolute Morality" at work at the human or sociological level at all.

Of course, there is also the very real possibility that I have an improper and flawed view of Karma.

Namaste Brian,

thank you for the post.

the concept of karma was/is a concept that is found in all Indian religious movements. it is, however, only the Buddhist position that karma can be changed and stopped altogether.

yes, i think that your understanding of the Moral Law of Karma, as we call it, is a bit incomplete. one of the real difficult things in speaking of karma is that people in the west already have an idea of what it is and how it works and what it does.. often, you find that you have to explain that the movie they watched that mentioned karma was not correct.. and the whole process can be quite time consuming and complex... and, quite honestly, not very rewarding for either person. this is not the case, however, when one is seriously interested and genuinely eager to learn what another believes and why.

given the nature of karma, i shall have to be rather loose and general with some terms... and readers should be aware that there will be some dispute about some of the things listed here by other Buddhist schools.

Karma is the law of moral causation. The theory of Karma is a fundamental doctrine in Buddhism. This belief was prevalent in India before the advent of the Buddha. Nevertheless, it was the Buddha who explained and formulated this doctrine in the complete form in which we have it today.

What is the cause of the inequality that exists among mankind?
Why should one person be brought up in the lap of luxury, endowed with fine mental, moral and physical qualities, and another in absolute poverty, steeped in misery?
Why should one person be a mental prodigy, and another an idiot?
Why should one person be born with saintly characteristics and another with criminal tendencies?
Why should some be linguistic, artistic, mathematically inclined, or musical from the very cradle?
Why should others be congenitally blind, deaf, or deformed?|
Why should some be blessed, and others cursed from their births?

Either this inequality of mankind has a cause, or it is purely accidental. No sensible person would think of attributing this unevenness, this inequality, and this diversity to blind chance or pure accident.

In this world nothing happens to a person that he does not for some reason or other deserve. Usually, men of ordinary intellect cannot comprehend the actual reason or reasons. The definite invisible cause or causes of the visible effect is not necessarily confined to the present life, they may be traced to a proximate or remote past birth.

According to Buddhism, this inequality is due not only to heredity, environment, "nature and nurture", but also to Karma. In other words, it is the result of our own past actions and our own present doings. We ourselves are responsible for our own happiness and misery. We create our own Heaven. We create our own Hell. We are the architects of our own fate.

Perplexed by the seemingly inexplicable, apparent disparity that existed among humanity, a young truth-seeker approached the Buddha and questioned him regarding this intricate problem of inequality:

"What is the cause, what is the reason, O Lord," questioned he, "that we find amongst mankind the short-lived and long-lived, the healthy and the diseased, the ugly and beautiful, those lacking influence and the powerful, the poor and the rich, the low-born and the high-born, and the ignorant and the wise?"

The Buddha’s reply was:

"All living beings have actions (Karma) as their own, their inheritance, their congenital cause, their kinsman, their refuge. It is Karma that differentiates beings into low and high states."

He then explained the cause of such differences in accordance with the law of cause and effect.

Certainly we are born with hereditary characteristics. At the same time we possess certain innate abilities that science cannot adequately account for. To our parents we are indebted for the gross sperm and ovum that form the nucleus of this so-called being. They remain dormant within each parent until this potential germinal compound is vitalised by the karmic energy needed for the production of the foetus. Karma is therefore the indispensable conceptive cause of this being.

The accumulated karmic tendencies, inherited in the course of previous lives, at times play a far greater role than the hereditary parental cells and genes in the formation of both physical and mental characteristics.

The Buddha, for instance, inherited, like every other person, the reproductive cells and genes from his parents. But physically, morally and intellectually there was none comparable to him in his long line of Royal ancestors. In the Buddha’s own words, he belonged not to the Royal lineage, but to that of the Aryan Buddhas. He was certainly a superman, an extraordinary creation of his own Karma.

According to the Lakkhana Sutta of Digha Nikaya, the Buddha inherited exceptional features, such as the 32 major marks, as the result of his past meritorious deeds. The ethical reason for acquiring each physical feature is clearly explained in the Sutta.

It is obvious from this unique case that karmic tendencies could not only influence our physical organism, but also nullify the potentiality of the parental cells and genes – hence the significance of the Buddha’s enigmatic statement, - "We are the heirs of our own actions."

Dealing with this problem of variation, the Atthasalini, being a commentary on the Abhidharma, states:

"Depending on this difference in Karma appears the differences in the birth of beings, high and low, base and exalted, happy and miserable. Depending on the difference in Karma appears the difference in the individual features of beings as beautiful and ugly, high-born or low born, well-built or deformed. Depending on the difference in Karma appears the difference in worldly conditions of beings, such as gain and loss, and disgrace, blame and praise, happiness and misery."

Thus, from a Buddhist point of view, our present mental, moral intellectual and temperamental differences are, for the most part, due to our own actions and tendencies, both past and present.

Although Buddhism attributes this variation to Karma, as being the chief cause among a variety, it does not, however, assert that everything is due to Karma. The law of Karma, important as it is, is only one of the twenty-four conditions described in Buddhist Philosophy.

Refuting the erroneous view that "whatsoever fortune or misfortune experienced is all due to some previous action", the Buddha said:

"So, then, according to this view, owing to previous action men will become murderers, thieves, unchaste, liars, slanderers, covetous, malicious and perverts. Thus, for those who fall back on the former deeds as the essential reason, there is neither the desire to do, nor effort to do, nor necessity to do this deed, or abstain from this deed."

It was this important text, which states the belief that all physical circumstances and mental attitudes spring solely from past Karma that Buddha contradicted. If the present life is totally conditioned or wholly controlled by our past actions, then certainly Karma is tantamount to fatalism or determinism or predestination. If this were true, free will would be an absurdity. Life would be purely mechanistic, not much different from a machine. Being created by an Almighty God who controls our destinies and predetermines our future, or being produced by an irresistible Karma that completely determines our fate and controls our life’s course, independent of any free action on our part, is essentially the same. The only difference lies in the two words God and Karma. One could easily be substituted for the other, because the ultimate operation of both forces would be identical.

Such a fatalistic doctrine is not the Buddhist law of Karma.

According to Buddhism, there are five orders or processes (niyama) which operate in the physical and mental realms.

They are:

Utu Niyama - physical inorganic order, e.g. seasonal phenomena of winds and rains. The unerring order of seasons, characteristic seasonal changes and events, causes of winds and rains, nature of heat, etc., all belong to this group.

Bija Niyama - order of germs and seeds (physical organic order), e.g. rice produced from rice-seed, sugary taste from sugar-cane or honey, peculiar characteristics of certain fruits, etc. The scientific theory of cells and genes and the physical similarity of twins may be ascribed to this order.

Karma Niyama - order of act and result, e.g., desirable and undesirable acts produce corresponding good and bad results. As surely as water seeks its own level so does Karma, given opportunity, produce its inevitable result, not in the form of a reward or punishment but as an innate sequence. This sequence of deed and effect is as natural and necessary as the way of the sun and the moon.

Dharma Niyama - order of the norm, e.g., the natural phenomena occurring at the advent of a Bodhisattva in his last birth. Gravitation and other similar laws of nature. The natural reason for being good and so forth, my be included in this group.

Citta Niyama - order or mind or psychic law, e.g., processes of consciousness, arising and perishing of consciousness, constituents of consciousness, power of mind, etc., including telepathy, telaesthesia, retro-cognition, premonition, clairvoyance, clairaudience, thought-reading and such other psychic phenomena which are inexplicable to modern science.

Every mental or physical phenomenon could be explained by these all-embracing five orders or processes which are laws in themselves. Karma as such is only one of these five orders. Like all other natural laws they demand no lawgiver.

Of these five, the physical inorganic order and the order of the norm are more or less mechanistic, though they can be controlled to some extent by human ingenuity and the power of mind. For example, fire normally burns, and extreme cold freezes, but man has walked scatheless over fire and meditated naked on Himalayan snows; horticulturists have worked marvels with flowers and fruits; Yogis have performed levitation. Psychic law is equally mechanistic, but Buddhist training aims at control of mind, which is possible by right understanding and skilful volition. Karma law operates quite automatically and, when the Karma is powerful, man cannot interfere with its inexorable result though he may desire to do so; but here also right understanding and skilful volition can accomplish much and mould the future. Good Karma, persisted in, can thwart the reaping of bad Karma, or as some Western scholars prefer to say ‘action influence’, is certainly an intricate law whose working is fully comprehended only by a Buddha. The Buddhist aims at the final destruction of all Karma.

WHAT IS KARMA?

The Pali term Karma literally means action or doing. Any kind of intentional action whether mental, verbal, or physical, is regarded as Karma. It covers all that is included in the phrase "thought, word and deed". Generally speaking, all good and bad action constitutes Karma. In its ultimate sense Karma means all moral and immoral volition. Involuntary, unintentional or unconscious actions, though technically deeds, do not constitute Karma, because volition, the most important factor in determining Karma, is absent.

The Buddha says:

"I declare, O Bhikkhus, that volition is Karma. Having willed one acts by body, speech, and thought." (Anguttara Nikaya)

Every volitional action of individuals, save those of Buddhas and Arahants, is called Karma. The exception made in their case is because they are delivered from both good and evil; they have eradicated ignorance and craving, the roots of Karma.

"Destroyed are their germinal seeds (Khina bija); selfish desires no longer grow," states the Ratana Sutta of Sutta nipata.

This does not mean that the Buddha and Arahantas are passive. They are tirelessly active in working for the real well being and happiness of all. Their deeds ordinarily accepted as good or moral, lack creative power as regards themselves. Understanding things as they truly are, they have finally shattered their cosmic fetters – the chain of cause and effect.

Karma does not necessarily mean past actions. It embraces both past and present deeds. Hence in one sense, we are the result of what we were; we will be the result of what we are. In another sense, it should be added, we are not totally the result of what we were; we will not absolutely be the result of what we are. The present is no doubt the offspring of the past and is the present of the future, but the present is not always a true index of either the past or the future; so complex is the working of Karma.

[Blue Heron]

[color=darkslateblue][font=arial][size=2]As far as past lives go, I personally have had experiences with my past. In doing so I did learn why some of my emotional needs were so intense and that I have been loved. Although in this time and place I find love eludes me.

A woman in the middle east sitting in the street begging for money. A veil covers part of her disfugured face. She struggles through this existance...a time before christ. Her disfigurement if from her "husband" who has cast her out.

A man in the 13th/14th century, with reddish hair & beard. He is a strong, hard working individual. He lives in a European forest. Not rich or exceptional, but his inner emotion was prevelant. There was intense love & gentleness. Even now, when I contemplate him he quiets my heart and mind. To me this is a special gift I am able to bring forward to the present.

And lastly, I've been researching information as I feel like I have a twin. The profoundly interesting thing I've discovered is there was someone born in 1907 with the exact same name as mine, they moved to my home town a year before my birth and died the day after my birth. People have often told me I can be wise beyond my years. I wonder if what I have been searching for is really my birth soul-mate.

[Vajradhara]

Namaste all,

i'll just offer this little bit to the topic at hand...

the ability to lucidly remember past lives is something that happens through Buddhist training. it's one of the "5 wonderful powers" that is acutalized through practice.

this is from my thread "long, detailed posts" :

Question: Is there such a thing as a human being who is reborn and who is able to speak accurately of his or her past existence?

Answer: Certainly, this is not an uncommon occurrence, and is in accordance with the tenets of Buddhism in respect to Karma.
The following (who form, an overwhelming majority of human beings) are generally unable to remember there past existences when reborn as human beings: Children who die young. Those who die old and senile. Those who are addicted to the drug or drink habit. Those whose mothers, during their conception, have been sickly or have had to toil laboriously, or have been reckless or imprudent during pregnancy. The children in the womb, being stunned and started, lose all knowledge of their past existence.
The following are possessed of a knowledge of their past existences, viz: Those who are not reborn (in the human world) but proceed to the world of the devas, of Brahmas, or to the regions of Hell, remember their past existences.
Those who die suddenly deaths from accidents, while in sound health, may also be possessed of this faculty in the next existence, provided that their mothers, in whose womb they are conceived, are healthy. Again, those who live steady, meritorious lives and who in their past existences have striven to attain, often attain it.
Lastly the Buddha, the Arahantas and Ariyas attain this gift which is known as pubbenivasa abhnna (Supernatural Power remembering previous existences).

[WHKeith]

While the objective reality of reincarnation may remain beyond rational proof, one of the best proofs I know is in the increasing number of accounts of young children who remember past lives. In Buddhist and Hindu cultures, of course, reincarnation is accepted as a natural part of the worldview, and a child remembering a past life is not thought particularly unusual. There have been numerous cases of children in India remembering details of other people's lives, pointing out spouses and relatives and recounting details of those other lives.

But in the West, children are discouraged from such thoughts. "Don't be silly." "It was just a dream." "It's just your imagination." Despite this, more and more cases have surfaced of WESTERN kids remembering past lives, and being able to lead parents and researchers to a particular house, identify people by name, and accurately describe the life of someone recently deceased.

I actually know one such child personally--though he doesn't have details enough or historical perspective enough to identify that past life. He was raised in a Wiccan household where such things are taken for granted, interestingly enough. He was playing with toy soldiers on the floor one day at about age five--staging some sort of elaborate battle. He stopped in the middle, then, looked up with wise eyes, and declared, "You may think this is from THIS life. It's not! This is from my LAST life."

Not proof, certainly. His parents might have mentioned past lives in his hearing once, and he was weaving the concept into fantasy. But it's fascinating nonetheless, especially since 5-year-olds have a hazy understanding of time and history at best.

Memory of past lives can be recovered through training--as described by Vajradhara--or through hypnotic regression or light trance work. And apparently, the amnesia that naturally blocks past-life memories for all at birth sometimes seems to simply break down, at least partly, especially if the individual child has not been brain-washed into ignoring such memories.

[Blue Heron]

Originally Posted by Vajradhara

Namaste all,

i'll just offer this little bit to the topic at hand...

the ability to lucidly remember past lives is something that happens through Buddhist training. it's one of the "5 wonderful powers" that is acutalized through practice.

this is from my thread "long, detailed posts" :

Question: Is there such a thing as a human being who is reborn and who is able to speak accurately of his or her past existence?

Answer: Certainly, this is not an uncommon occurrence, and is in accordance with the tenets of Buddhism in respect to Karma.
The following (who form, an overwhelming majority of human beings) are generally unable to remember there past existences when reborn as human beings: Children who die young. Those who die old and senile. Those who are addicted to the drug or drink habit. Those whose mothers, during their conception, have been sickly or have had to toil laboriously, or have been reckless or imprudent during pregnancy. The children in the womb, being stunned and started, lose all knowledge of their past existence.
The following are possessed of a knowledge of their past existences, viz: Those who are not reborn (in the human world) but proceed to the world of the devas, of Brahmas, or to the regions of Hell, remember their past existences.
Those who die suddenly deaths from accidents, while in sound health, may also be possessed of this faculty in the next existence, provided that their mothers, in whose womb they are conceived, are healthy. Again, those who live steady, meritorious lives and who in their past existences have striven to attain, often attain it.
Lastly the Buddha, the Arahantas and Ariyas attain this gift which is known as pubbenivasa abhnna (Supernatural Power remembering previous existences).

So, based on your explanation, I should not be able to recall such events. My reality is that I do. I am not a Buddhast, but wiccan. Since the discovery of the other older person, I've been searching for her life and what she wanted to accomplish. I know I am on my correct path at this time and consistent with what my purpose here and now is. I find it all very fascinating to be able to recall my past lives and apply those lessons learned to here and now. I guess some things never really change, only our soul does.

[Vajradhara]

Originally Posted by Blue Heron

So, based on your explanation, I should not be able to recall such events. My reality is that I do. I am not a Buddhast, but wiccan. Since the discovery of the other older person, I've been searching for her life and what she wanted to accomplish. I know I am on my correct path at this time and consistent with what my purpose here and now is. I find it all very fascinating to be able to recall my past lives and apply those lessons learned to here and now. I guess some things never really change, only our soul does.

Namaste Blue Heron,

on the contrary... you could have led a merit filled life in the past or any of the other methods of death that would still permit you to recall past lives.

in any case, the post does not stipulate that only Buddhists can do this... what it does say is that, by practicing the Buddhist tradition, if you formerly could not recall past lives, you would be able to depending on your level of realization.

i hope that clears it up a bit

[littlemissattitude]

What a fascinating thread. I've been interested in the possibilities of reincarnation ever since I first heard of the concept when I was about 10 or 11 years old. That was when I heard my mother make a comment to someone that when I was very young, I had her half believing in reincarnation becuase I came up with things that were so outlandish coming from a child.

First of all, I have to say that reincarnation makes at least as much sense to me as a system as the usual Christian idea that you get one try and then you're stuck with either heven or hell, depending on how you behave and what belief you profess. It strikes me that the idea of reincarnation treats life as a learning process, while the Christian system treats life as a test - and the individual starts out with negative points due to original sin. Against all evidence, I tend to believe that the universe is essentially fair, if not always pleasant, and reincarnation seems to me to be the fairer of the two systems. (I'm not saying, of course, that there are only two possible systems of belief concerning the soul and how it works out its eternal progression. It is just that I grew up in a Christian paradigm, so I am using it as a contrast to the ideas surrounding reincarnation.)

I am open to the idea of reincarnation, but as I've been known to tell people, I believe in it on alternate Thursdays, am sure it is a load of bunk every first Tuesday of the month, and think the jury is still out the rest of the time. Which is to say, I've had experiences suggestive of past life memories, but I'm not willing to state unequvoically that I think that is what those experiences were. I could have been tuning in to some sort of collective unconscious. It could have been my admittedly very active imagination. Those experiences could have been many things. I just don't know. I do know that I've had enough fringe-type experiences in my life - of a variety of kinds - that I am not willing to say that anything is impossible.

Before I go (it is getting late here, and with daylight savings time just over and the time changed my sleep/wake rhythms are all messed up), I do have to make a comment about the photo that accompanies the link to this thread on the front page. The photo shows a sculpture, "The Dying Gaul", which is my favorite sculpture not by Michelangelo. It is actually a Roman marble copy of a Greek bronze. Anyway, the first time I ever saw a photo of him, I was reading a library book about ancient Mediterranean civilizations. I don't know what it was about that particular sculpture, but the moment I saw it I burst into tears. It just destroyed me. Now, I'm a fairly emotional person at times, but statues don't generally affect me that way. Ever since then, I have loved that sculpture. So, when I saw it on the front page here, I had to look in on this thread.

[I, Brian]

The Dying Gaul is a brilliant work of art and human expression, chosen implicitly for representing this thread on the main site. I had to think of something that somehow represented both life and death. The Dying Gaul is both living and dying, alive and dead - somehow it seemed like the perfect powerful symbol for encapsulating the topic.

And back on track...as has been quite emphasised, reservations about past life experience seems to be a very healthy attitude.

[Rev. LKKP]

I find it rather ironic that I stumbled upon this forum and thread. This subject has been much on my mind this week, but today I was merely looking at a small business forum where I had just registered and saw someone's signature which led me here. (I thank you Brian)

Having been fascinated by this subject for many years, I don't know that I could add any insight into the subject that has not already been covered by the many posts in the thread. But I guess sharing and comparing thoughts and experiences is what it's all about here, eh? :-)

I have really had some odd thoughts on this subject for many years. As a child, I was pretty much left to my own devices on a regular basis and rarely was told to hush about my imagination as few would listen to anything I said anyway! *L* However, I do recall much from age three on - and I had a very strong sense of my own identity as an individual - and often intuited things that even I knew at the time I was not old enough to understand. I just took it as a given that I would understand them when I was ready to.

Being from a backsliding catholic family, we rarely set foot in a church, but I had a very strong sense of what spirituality meant to me in my life, and began my personal search very young - at age 7 I began going to different churches on my own to see what they offered and where I agreed and disagreed. And the one shot lifetime never made sense to me - not then and not now. How could anyone really learn anything of value in one lifetime? And why would I spend an eternity in hell for being what I was made? For what I did perhaps, but just for being born? That was a concept I just couldn't grasp.

And over the years, the search became more of a knowledge quest. I finally found myself in too many different places spiritually, so I began to settle down and paganism and witchcraft became my choice as a practice - but I personally consider myself a Polytheistic Universalist Witch (yes, I made that up but it fits) being that I always been seriously drawn to more of a universal point of view than most Witch and Wiccan modern traditions subscribe to.

And once I had really chosen my direction, some odd things began happening. People who I didn't even know seemed to know me - and would bring up a particular lifetime they knew me in. Up to that time I saw no real value in remembering past lives. As far as I was concerned there was a good reason to forget them - less baggage. I had a fear of ever being arrogant for some reason - always had - but I assumed I would figure out what was behind that if I needed to should that be related to a past life as I suspected.

As the years went on, I ran into more people who had known me in this exact same past life. I never brought it up - they always did. I never asked questions - they always just told me what they recalled. Some things I had already remembered, some things others had brought up from a different perspective - but all the same.

After roughly 40 or so people doing this - yes I kept count - I finally gave in and accepted it, though even now I am not the one to bring it up unless the people I am talking with are the ones who brought it to me first. I personally have no desire whatsoever to be labelled a crackpot, and no matter how much independent verification I have of these meetings and incidences, skeptics abound (which is healthy) and I can't blame them for being skeptical - but I also can prove none of this if they choose not to believe me. With most people out there, you could show them documented histories until you were blue in the face, and they would find another reason you knew these things.

I will say several good things came of all of this. I understand my fear of being too arrogant - and finally realized that being confident is NOT the same thing *whew* I finally understand quite a few things about myself that I probably wouldn't have before, like my sense of responsibility to people that I don't even know and such. There are things that these different people have remembered about me that were not at all nice - and I still carry quite a sense of indebtedness for all that. (and no, I do not let myself be a doormat over that!) But I was also able to forgive myself for what I had done - and move on.

Why I ran into so many I don't know - unless the Universe has decided I was particularly dense in my refusal to believe them! And while the number is currently 40 - that changed as late as last year - I doubt it will stop at that. But who knows?
*long winded eh?*

And as for the children remembering past lives, I had a friend's child years ago while I was doing a reading for her mother walked up to her mom out of the blue and said "I was a Lin (my name :-) before." Her mom was startled and said "what??" Her daughter was only 3 at the time! She pointed at the cards and my pentacle and said again "I was a Lin - not when you were my mommy, but somebody else." You could have knocked us both over with a feather!

I am still shaking my head in wonder at winding up in here tonight, but nice to meet you all!

Lin

[The Fool]

Originally Posted by Rev. LKKP

But I guess sharing and comparing thoughts and experiences is what it's all about here, eh? :-)

Absolutely - and welcome to the comparative-religion forum!