must religion come to an end?

[_Z_]

good point mee, i think the ‘religion’ that is left after the fire will be a far truer one.

[mee]

Originally Posted by _Z_

good point mee, i think the ‘religion’ that is left after the fire will be a far truer one.

The book of revelation is highly symbolic and fire represents total destruction .

and the book of revelation also mentions that when false religion is ending it will be as if a millstone is around her neck , down she will go never to be coming up again .


And a strong angel lifted up a stone like a great millstone and hurled it into the sea, saying: "Thus with a swift pitch will Babylon the great city be hurled down, and she will never be found again revelation 18;21


and then in revelation 19;1-3 it says ,


After these things I heard what was as a loud voice of a great crowd in heaven. They said: "Praise Jah, YOU people! The salvation and the glory and the power belong to our God,

because his judgments are true and righteous. For he has executed judgment upon the great harlot who corrupted the earth with her fornication, and he has avenged the blood of his slaves at her hand." 3 And right away for the second time they said: "Praise Jah, YOU people! And the smoke from her goes on ascending forever and ever."

[Bandit]

Originally Posted by _Z_

has religion come to an end?

simple question, difficult answer. in my mind i think people will probably want religion of some kind for a long while yet, this is more an intellectual/wisdom question.

i think religions agree and contradict each other on many levels, without believing in a single one it is easy to get confused. in the end it seams like it would be better if i went through life as if there were no religions.

as long as i can look life in the eye and see what it is thinking, i can find my own answers.

how do you feel; must religion come to an end?

I would not say it is going to end but rather the same old stuff/religion/topic never changes & it goes around & around in circles like a dog chasing it's tail or some carnival ride, so in a sense it ends but at the same time it is the same old dogs butt being chased. Religion to me is kind of like a circle of deads ends.

How do I feel? I feel the world would be a safer place if religion did not exist, that also includes the communist thought of trying to end religion. Maybe the no religion religion? The contradiciton you mention is only there when you view it from the outside. The people inside have all these lines drawn connecting the dots creating their religion & if you try to connect the dots a different way...then you end up in a different religion...same basic dots only jumbled up differently & they may toss a few dots if they do not like them.

However you are correct about one thing, there are way too many contradictions for them to all be chalked off as right. Institutionalized religion is definately dying & those numbers are getting smaller. In the USA about 15 to 20% claim no religion. In Britain & sweden it is more like 50% or maybe more who claim no religion.

What I see happening is, more people are free to see all the inconsistancy & crapola dogma that does not add up, so they leave & do not want to hear about it.
In that sense it is ending.

[mee]

when Jehovah manouvers things to bring an end to false religion it will be the start of the GREAT TRIBULATION.



revelation 7;14.
So right away I said to him: "My lord, you are the one that knows." And he said to me: "These are the ones that come out of the great tribulation, and they have washed their robes and made them white in the blood of the Lamb.

those who have heeded the command to GET OUT OF HER revelation 18;4 will get through the tribulation.


for then there will be great tribulation such as has not occurred since the world’s beginning until now, no, nor will occur again. matthew 24;21


for those days will be [days of] a tribulation such as has not occurred from [the] beginning of the creation which God created until that time, and will not occur again. In fact, unless Jehovah had cut short the days, no flesh would be saved. But on account of the chosen ones whom he has chosen he has cut short the days. mark 13;19-20

[wil]

Originally Posted by Bandit

Institutionalized religion is definately dying & those numbers are getting smaller. In the USA about 15 to 20% claim no religion. In Britain & sweden it is more like 50% or maybe more who claim no religion.

Namaste Bandit, you just struck a very strange nerve.

Is there something regarding socialism that is connected with lack of religion? Communist Russia we know outlawed it. China doesn't react to favorably to it.

Don't shoot me but I'm suddenly wondering what a chart that looked country by country of those who claim no religion and then add another column of the percentage of people on the dole.

ie is there a relationship that if they gov't provides the paycheck, the housing, the food, the health care the gov't becomes your god, your religion as it is the source of your supply?

[Bandit]

Originally Posted by wil

Namaste Bandit, you just struck a very strange nerve.

Is there something regarding socialism that is connected with lack of religion? Communist Russia we know outlawed it. China doesn't react to favorably to it.

Don't shoot me but I'm suddenly wondering what a chart that looked country by country of those who claim no religion and then add another column of the percentage of people on the dole.

ie is there a relationship that if they gov't provides the paycheck, the housing, the food, the health care the gov't becomes your god, your religion as it is the source of your supply?

You could start here:
Irreligion - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Then have a look at different public opinion, polls, demographics...
Outside of the polls you can also look at the big cathedrals & church schools that close & have few people sitting on the pews. But then take your Joel Olsteen type which is a little different as it teaches application but reminds me of Amway.

I am not sure if there is any relationship there between government & religion as far as what people in free nations would choose, but I would tend to think it is because of the violence & hate found in both religion & communism.
When you go communist then you go to the other extreme but as you also know both catholic & islam religion have done the same exact things as the communists promoting fear, war & death. I am sure the growing numbers have varied reasons such as hypocrisy, cultish, polygamy, . I would bet the history of violence once a child learns about it becomes a big reason they say no to religions. A one semester history class in school that teaches the history of various religions would not be a bad idea.

I am sure you also know that in many countries only a certain percentage of 'other' religions are allowed & they keep a close watch on that. On the other hand many people are taught fear as a child if they should ever leave the one & only right religion. There are some very big train wrecks in religion.
I know some people just want their children to have a belief & could care less if they change or what they do with it when they get older. They just feel some kind of belief is necessary to get them started at least wondering.

As far as the socialism aspects, I don't know if it is that easy to say that has an influence based on choice, since choice is not allowed. Marxism, Socialsim, Communism - a definate influence, there is not much difference in the final objective. I do see big changes global ahead that will change the way the youth view religion so maybe government is doing that without us realizing?

It would make a good study & be interesting to read material by those who choose no religion so long as it is not too hostile or directed toward one particular group. Remember, Wil, just because it says they choose no religion that does not mean they have no beliefs.
One last thing I just thought of, you know that race played a big part of this for awhile not too long ago in the states. If you had black skin, the white skin people said you were not allowed to be a Christian. How ignorant can people really be?

A large graph or chart like you say, then study why it is changing would be great.

[Bandit]

Hey Wil,

Here is a more recent survey that helps explain some of it. It does not say "WHY" but just gives figures for the USA & dates it from the 70s to the present. The census does not track religious affiliation but does just the opposite & tracks those who leave. Aint that funny!

http://www.nytimes.com/2008/02/25/us...ligion.html?hp

For at least a generation, scholars have noted that more Americans are moving among faiths, as denominational loyalty erodes. But the survey, based on interviews with more than 35,000 Americans, offers one of the clearest views yet of that trend, scholars said. The United States Census does not track religious affiliation.

One interesting thing was the catholic religion is the biggest on the decline but also says they found that the ones who claim no religion would belong to the 4th largest religious group (if it were a religion). Aint that weird how it happened so fast?

But then figure in Sweden (supposedly a christian nation?) & why its numbers are triple? Makes no sense.

[_Z_]

i agree bandit, religion will end but it will never end. there is too much freedom in thought and literature for dogma to continue and this process has probably been going on since the guttengerg press was invented.

i also agree, that anti religion is itself a religion [as is science]. i think we can say that its the approach and the attachement that makes people not want to go outside the box, which is the actual religion. funny how i doubt if that is what any religious founder has taught!

[Bishadi]

has religion come to an end?

as far as ‘it’ continuing as a belief of truth…………….. absolutely! And to observe each religion, when they address the ‘final days’ then each suggests an end to religious beliefs or false doctrine…..

and to observe most any Christianic sects….. ever notice there is no ‘after’ revelations scriptures….. since once the truth is known, like Ptolemy…. ‘Thanks for the contribution but thanks to a Copernicus, Understanding now EXISTS; the globe ‘is’ round.

simple question, difficult answer.

Yes and no….. simple logic makes common sense out of it.

i think religions agree and contradict each other on many levels, without believing in a single one it is easy to get confused. in the end it seams like it would be better if i went through life as if there were no religions.

Would be like saying ‘I don’t need training wheels’ to begin your first usage of a bike.


Think in the lines of the history and ‘story line’ value. Each story has merit in one sense or another but it can be universally agreed that if the truth of what life is and how it works was known by each person ever born, then the ideas of faith and hope, will fade to extinction.

as long as i can look life in the eye and see what it is thinking, i can find my own answers.

Fair enough as most of the indigenous find God in nature and how can any blame them, they see life, the personalities within each of the species and I have never seen nature lie just to save face.

how do you feel; must religion come to an end?

‘Must’ is not the best analogy….. ‘will’ is. They will come to an end!

Have you ever noticed why the Christian sects are so hyped about the apocalypse (the revealing) or better said, why this sect incorporated 2 comings (one good guy, one bad guy)… is that in the original writings they can see that when the truth does exist, it will come from a man, and even as most all faiths mention a man will bring the truth, the christian sect incorporated 2 faces to the same event. Where the truth is what is being sought, but then an enormous amount of retribution will be felt by how they imposed so much misleading doctrine and the religious leaders will be unemployed, forever.

Have any heard the comment….. ‘then the young will begin to teach the old’…..

The new generations will know the truth when they see it, the old are too stubborn and faithfully bound…….. One side likes the truth in nuts and bolts, the other gave up a long time ago and retains a complacency since they really have no clue nor the intent to seek the material available….. but we have the internet and any single line item of information we want we can find. From the math (2nd law is incorrect) to any religious opinion any could ever want….

All that each can and must retain by choice, is your integrity. Just be honest with yourself and if you are not sure, look it up.

The final literature to be prepared will be called Understanding but until then, start with ‘light is life’ or simply that energy itself is em (light or electromagnetism upon mass) …. From the very first ‘atoms and energy’ versus adam and eve, forward…. Observe the progression and the rules simply reveal themselves.

Mass/energy/time; the trinity….. it’s actually really easy if you look at the aunk of Egypt. AS electric and magnetic fields in perpendicular planes show us a cross, the loop of the aunk is time.

[greymare]

The Ank is a Key. (I always thought)

[Bishadi]

Originally Posted by greymare

The Ank is a Key. (I always thought)

Well if you had your Einstein hat on you may have recognized something

Mass/energy/time; the trinity….. it’s actually really easy if you look at the aunk of Egypt. AS electric and magnetic fields in perpendicular planes show us a cross, the loop of the aunk is time.

as in order for the truth to hold up, it must have a 'key' of a mathematical theorem to work.

[greymare]

no sorry, not thiss little black duck. i thought literally, a key. I dont do math

[Bishadi]

Originally Posted by greymare

no sorry, not thiss little black duck. i thought literally, a key. I dont do math

It's ok, that math is not important to me, either. The only reason I played in the first place what to understand and as soon as the answers were understood, i simply put it aside as the priority.

The 'people' for the most part or the majority on the globe, do not know the math behind what makes things work but be quite certain at least someone does.

[mee]

Originally Posted by Bishadi

and to observe most any Christianic sects….. ever notice there is no ‘after’ revelations scriptures…..

To live forever, both Armageddon survivors and resurrected ones will have to obey God’s commandments, including whatever new requirements Jehovah might reveal during the thousand years.

so, individuals will be judged on the basis of what they do during Judgment Day.


How grand it will be when the knowledge of God fills the earth!

There will be an extensive educational program under the direction of the King Jesus Christ and his 144,000 corulers.

New "scrolls" will then come into use.

Evidently these are God’s written instructions that will serve as a basis for educating earth’s inhabitants. (Revelation 20:12)

Mankind will learn, not war, but peace.

All destructive weapons will be gone forever. (Psalm 46:9)

Inhabitants of the new world will be taught to treat their fellow humans with love, respect, and dignity.

[Bishadi]

To live forever, both Armageddon survivors and resurrected ones will have to obey God’s commandments, including whatever new requirements Jehovah might reveal during the thousand years.

First, what is the physical reality behind ‘resurrection’…. Without the magical stuff, how could this literally occur?

.There will be an extensive educational program

New "scrolls" will then come into use.

Evidently these are God’s written instructions that will serve as a basis for educating earth’s inhabitants. (Revelation 20:12)

Mankind will learn, not war, but peace.

Awesome……. Basically the truth; knowledge will combine mankind and peace will exist, finally.

How grand it will be when the knowledge of God fills the earth!

Exactly! And that knowledge must include the ‘nature’ of existence. The single form that combines each of the religions, the sciences and even the beautiful wisdom of the old philosophers.

All destructive weapons will be gone forever. (Psalm 46:9)

Just like the need of religions. None will remain as the guide to the children…….

Inhabitants of the new world will be taught to treat their fellow humans with love, respect, and dignity.

Which includes absolute responsibility to the words and representations they convey. (honesty)

so, individuals will be judged on the basis of what they do during Judgment Day

and what they did prior.

As the truth be; nothing will ever remove the atrocities of ill regard. Each who damages others with no concern or responsibility will be the first to be judged.

As their brothers will equally have the eyes of truth within their mind (mark upon their head).

Our brother/sisters; our children; will be our judges.