Mark of the Beast

[Amica]

Hi!

Wow, I have not heard of the ID cards. Where can I learn more about them?
Many people are not sure what the mark would be like. Some believe it is rather symbolical, others believe it will appear literal. Of course, my guess would be that, since religious Christians are expecting the prophecy to come true, perhaps the Antichrist regime would want to mask the mark to deceive the masses. I would imagine that Christians would raise alarms, just like it happened with the VeriChip.
I heard that the VeriChip is proposing to use the chip for anti-terrorist purposes. Many Christians oppose such a thing and believe that if VeriChip gets approved, that it will fullfill St. John's prophecy.

[Bandit]

Originally Posted by Amica

Hi!

Wow, I have not heard of the ID cards. Where can I learn more about them?
Many people are not sure what the mark would be like. Some believe it is rather symbolical, others believe it will appear literal. Of course, my guess would be that, since religious Christians are expecting the prophecy to come true, perhaps the Antichrist regime would want to mask the mark to deceive the masses. I would imagine that Christians would raise alarms, just like it happened with the VeriChip.
I heard that the VeriChip is proposing to use the chip for anti-terrorist purposes. Many Christians oppose such a thing and believe that if VeriChip gets approved, that it will fullfill St. John's prophecy.

i think it is going to be just like credit cards. it will appear to be a good thing at first & everyone will fall for it being the answer to stop problems like theft & terrorism. then once it is in place there will be no stopping it & it is just a matter of time because the generation behind us will not know the difference. IMO
this has been around for decades , & used often during war time, but never on a global scale in every day life or just for buying & selling.

all of my dogs have microchips in there heads for ID & we know they do not test things on animals unless they have some thought on using it with humans later.
i have been watching trends like this very closely for about 25 years.
here are a couple of pages but if you want recent studies & individual cases on the issue, let me know by way of a PM.



http://www.preventgenocide.org/preve...ctors/IDcards/


http://www.no2id.net/

[smkolins]

Originally Posted by Amica

Thank you for the references. I will read them first before I reply to them.

I continue to look forward to your thoughtful consideration of them.

[Amica]

Hi

What is interesting to me is that even thogh the ID cards are certainly one way of controling the masses, it still can be fooled. One can lie about their religion on their ID cards, because who is to say what the person's personal beliefs are really?

I remember in the old communist Yugoslavia, all non-Christians (Muslims, Jews, Gypsies, etc) had to declare themselves to be one of the following: a) Croat, b) Serb and c) undecided/Yugoslav. Jews were almost never involved in any political issues and almost never mentioned except for the Holocoust. Muslims were written with small 'm' signifying that they were not considered that important in Yugoslavia. Islam was with purposeful idea proclaimed to be a nationality rather than faith in Yugoslavia, but one still could not declare themselves as Muslim in his/her ID card. Hence, during the Bosnian War, everyone new Bosnian Muslims not as Bosniacks but as 'Muslims' as nationality, not a people of islamic faith with nationality of Bosniacks.

I don't know... I think ID cards perhaps could be one way of controling the masses, but won't be very controlling. A white Muslim can lie about their faith on the ID card if they want to, especially if they have a name that does not automatically connect them to Arabia.

John speaks of trade and the number/mark. Unless one has to have a specific ID only for trade, then perhaps this would be different.

[Bandit]

Originally Posted by Amica

Hi



I don't know... I think ID cards perhaps could be one way of controling the masses, but won't be very controlling. A white Muslim can lie about their faith on the ID card if they want to, especially if they have a name that does not automatically connect them to Arabia.

John speaks of trade and the number/mark. Unless one has to have a specific ID only for trade, then perhaps this would be different.

i dont think they are being fooled Amica from the current things that i see. i dont think it is about controlling masses like marshal law or who does drugs, but finding out who is who in there beliefs- like a filter or sifter.
they are not interested in who serves 'God', they want to know who serves Jesus & these are the ones being denied spending money & loans & things to fix or build there churches. they are held in unfair trials with accusations where they are not allowed to defend themselves, then imprisoned because there ID states a specific belief & not just something about God or 'A' religion. this religion on an ID has a very long list of cases that you may not be aware of.

if i lie about what i believe, then that would be the same as denying what i believe & WHO i believe in. the only thing i see, is it is not on a global scale but within certain countries.
i hope that makes sense.

[smkolins]

Originally Posted by Bandit

they are not interested in who serves 'God', they want to know who serves Jesus & these are the ones being denied spending money & loans & things to fix or build there churches. ...

If "the government shall be upon his shoulder" and "Of the increase of his government and peace there shall be no end" from Isaiah 9:6-7, wouldn't an identification program of some sort go along with an increasing singular governmental system? Wouldn't the spread of such a system seem to some pov? It could be the system you fear happened a while ago and has already been overrun by the increasing system foretold by Isaiah.

[lunamoth]

Originally Posted by smkolins

wouldn't an identification program of some sort go along with an increasing singular governmental system?

Why would this be so? If you are part of the One why do you need to differentiate yourself from anyone or anything? Seems to me like giving up those ID cards would be more meaningful.

just my 2c
lunamoth

[Bandit]

Originally Posted by smkolins

If "the government shall be upon his shoulder" and "Of the increase of his government and peace there shall be no end" from Isaiah 9:6-7, wouldn't an identification program of some sort go along with an increasing singular governmental system? Wouldn't the spread of such a system seem to some pov? It could be the system you fear happened a while ago and has already been overrun by the increasing system foretold by Isaiah.

there was no such thing as fingerprinting & eye retna for ID. there is no way possible to do this on a full scale before computers. Part of Is. 9:6 seems to still be in part in prophecy as far as I can see & is talking about a spiritual government not an earthly one, to me.
the world has NEVER been under a one world rule for anything. it most certainly is a reality right this very minute in many countries & those people do face fear, torture & even death if they even speak the name of Jesus. Having it on there ID card just puts them right into the UNWANTED list right from the start.

i think your timing is mixed up but if you want to believe it already happened that is up to you.
i do see it as a gradual crescendo, not something that happened or will just happen over night.

[smkolins]

Originally Posted by lunamoth

Why would this be so? If you are part of the One why do you need to differentiate yourself from anyone or anything? Seems to me like giving up those ID cards would be more meaningful.

just my 2c
lunamoth

The process is gradual according to Isaiah. Otherwise why would a government increase? Some would be part and some not.

[smkolins]

Originally Posted by Bandit

there was no such thing as fingerprinting & eye retna for ID.

Of course not. But the idea of a country knowing it's people, like in a census, is very old. I don't know if it dates back to Isaiah's time or not. And irregardless even if it was totally unknown in his time, the point is that setting up a government that is going to progressively rule the world will require something of its citizens by way of identification.

Originally Posted by Bandit

Part of Is. 9:6 seems to still be in part in prophecy as far as I can see & is talking about a spiritual government not an earthly one, to me.

Now where in this does it say this is not an earthly government?

Originally Posted by Bandit

having it on there ID card just puts them right into the UNWANTED list right from the start.

I think it common knowledge that most places on the planet are hazardous to part of a variety of religions. For example Baha'is in Iran have a long history of martyrdoms.[/quote]

[Bandit]

Originally Posted by smkolins

Of course not. But the idea of a country knowing it's people, like in a census, is very old. I don't know if it dates back to Isaiah's time or not. And irregardless even if it was totally unknown in his time, the point is that setting up a government that is going to progressively rule the world will require something of its citizens by way of identification.




Now where in this does it say this is not an earthly government?



I think it common knowledge that most places on the planet are hazardous to part of a variety of religions. For example Baha'is in Iran have a long history of martyrdoms.

[/quote]

because Jesus said it. his kingdom is not of this world though in the world NOW, but not of the world. sorry but it is not an earthly power or national government if that is what you think- i do not believe that & i dont think IS. 9:6 has anything to do with this.

it seems like you think this is no big deal?. it is not just about being murdered or taking a census & it is about going after the remnant of the righteous seed not just knowing what religion you are.

[truthseeker]

I think it is an earthly government. CNN doesn't cover everything, you know.
And should it be an earthly government, it would suit the perpetrator that most of those that would have some clue as to the happening would have their heads and eyes stuck in the sky instead of looking directly at them. Why couldn't it be that the writers Isaiah and John (of Revelation) not be aware of a plan among a group to, like Pinky, 'take over the world'? Do you really believe it is not possible? That you actually and really truly do vote for your American President no matter what the international situation may be? Do you really think that an elite would leave the decision to a bunch of 'workers' (modern day slaves) for their benefit? There was a time when it was clear that only those in a particular social status were allowed to vote. Now, it is all an illusion - especially since workers outweigh the elite; wouldn't want anything like the French Revolution/Haitian Revolt occurring again, now would we? We all like to think that we are highly intelligent but everything written in black and white just isn't so. Remember when the layman was not allowed to own a bible? You think the writers of the bible were average folk among society? They were not - they all had high social status. The bits of history that you read was not written by the average Joe getting a break in the town's newspaper.

[smkolins]

to the extent it is a government mentioned, whatever the circumstances, I wonder what kind of government it would be? Would it resemble a monarchy? Would it have democratic forms at all?

I wonder if the Bible has any clues....

[lunamoth]

Originally Posted by smkolins

The process is gradual according to Isaiah. Otherwise why would a government increase? Some would be part and some not.

How do you get this gradual change out of Isaiah?

[Bandit]

Originally Posted by truthseeker

I think it is an earthly government. CNN doesn't cover everything, you know.
And should it be an earthly government, it would suit the perpetrator that most of those that would have some clue as to the happening would have their heads and eyes stuck in the sky instead of looking directly at them. Why couldn't it be that the writers Isaiah and John (of Revelation) not be aware of a plan among a group to, like Pinky, 'take over the world'? Do you really believe it is not possible? That you actually and really truly do vote for your American President no matter what the international situation may be? Do you really think that an elite would leave the decision to a bunch of 'workers' (modern day slaves) for their benefit? There was a time when it was clear that only those in a particular social status were allowed to vote. Now, it is all an illusion - especially since workers outweigh the elite; wouldn't want anything like the French Revolution/Haitian Revolt occurring again, now would we? We all like to think that we are highly intelligent but everything written in black and white just isn't so. Remember when the layman was not allowed to own a bible? You think the writers of the bible were average folk among society? They were not - they all had high social status. The bits of history that you read was not written by the average Joe getting a break in the town's newspaper.

Truthseeker, you totally lost me on your post . Why would CNN care about the Kingdom of God? all they care about is the crap that keeps the world screwed up & pretend like we are making some kind of huge progress.

this kingdom is an eternal kingdom with eternal power & glory of the almighty God through Jesus.
not a an earthly president or religious leader with bloodshed & money on there minds.
Jesus would never issue in something like the mark of the beast, that is coming right out of the dragons mouth & the beast supports it.
CNN will be focusing on the mark of the beast as a good thing, but the bible tells us what it is for.
can you please explain what you mean? because if i missed something i need & want to know.