Islam's view about the Trinity

[n4h1z]

Peace to all....

This is more to a question rather than Islamic view on the trinity. I would like to pose some arguments and a question about the trinity referring to the Bible it self.....

John 14:9 : Jesus saith unto him, Have I been so long time with you, and yet hast thou not known me, Philip? he that hath seen me hath seen the Father; and how sayest thou then, Shew us the Father?

John 14:10 : Believest thou not that I am in the Father, and the Father in me? the words that I speak unto you I speak not of myself: but the Father that dwelleth in me, he doeth the works.

Then refer to this...
John 17:23 : I in them, and thou in me, that they may be made perfect in one; and that the world may know that thou hast sent me, and hast loved them, as thou hast loved me.

Notice that there is a phrase "I in them". The word "them" is referred to the disciples of Jesus and "I" refers God. So the the word "I" and the word "them" means that God is with the disciples. If you believe in the unison of The Father and Jesus, you also ought believe the unison of The Father with all the 12 disciples. So it's not only Jesus and the Holy Spirit is one with The Father but also the 12 disciples...not just 3 in 1 but 15 in 1. Based on this contradiction which is the correct one, 3 becomes 1 or 15 becomes 1.
John 14:9 & 10 seems to match each other...but John 17:23 is a bit different

Question: Does John 17:23 contradicts John 14:9 & 14:10 and thus contradicts the concept of trinity?

Peace...

[Saltmeister]

Originally Posted by n4h1z

Peace to all....

This is more to a question rather than Islamic view on the trinity. I would like to pose some arguments and a question about the trinity referring to the Bible it self.....

John 14:9 : Jesus saith unto him, Have I been so long time with you, and yet hast thou not known me, Philip? he that hath seen me hath seen the Father; and how sayest thou then, Shew us the Father?

John 14:10 : Believest thou not that I am in the Father, and the Father in me? the words that I speak unto you I speak not of myself: but the Father that dwelleth in me, he doeth the works.

Then refer to this...
John 17:23 : I in them, and thou in me, that they may be made perfect in one; and that the world may know that thou hast sent me, and hast loved them, as thou hast loved me.

Notice that there is a phrase "I in them". The word "them" is referred to the disciples of Jesus and "I" refers God. So the the word "I" and the word "them" means that God is with the disciples. If you believe in the unison of The Father and Jesus, you also ought believe the unison of The Father with all the 12 disciples. So it's not only Jesus and the Holy Spirit is one with The Father but also the 12 disciples...not just 3 in 1 but 15 in 1. Based on this contradiction which is the correct one, 3 becomes 1 or 15 becomes 1.
John 14:9 & 10 seems to match each other...but John 17:23 is a bit different

Question: Does John 17:23 contradicts John 14:9 & 14:10 and thus contradicts the concept of trinity?

Peace...

I don't think it is contradictory. I see it as a way of saying that we live in God and that God lives in us. We and God are still separate beings, but we are held together because of God's love for us and our love for Him. It's not talking about the 12 disciples, but all of God's people.

John 17:20: I pray not only for them, but also for those who believe in me because of their message. I pray that they may all be one.

This refers to everybody that believes in Christ.

The verses you listed above, I believe, explain how God Himself is the Temple we live in, and we are the temple that He lives in. Christ is the cornerstone (foundation) of that Temple.

Come as living stones, and let yourselves be used in building the spiritual temple, where you will serve as holy priests to offer spiritual and acceptable sacrifices to God through Jesus Christ. 1 Peter 2:5

You, too, are built upon the foundation laid by the apostles and prophets, the cornerstone being Christ Jesus himself. He is the one who holds the whole building together and makes it grow into a sacred temple dedicated to the Lord. In union with him you too are being built with all the others into a place where God lives through his Spirit. Ephesians 2:20-22

I think the verses above are more about togetherness than unity.

Perhaps another thing you might like to know is that Jesus, the Son of God, or Christ, is the Christian concept of God's Word. Christ is God's Word living in us. That's why it says "I in them."

While we live in God, but are still separate beings from God, the Word is one with God. The Word (Christ) is in God, but God is also in the Word because the Word is God's Revelation of Himself. God is the Source (Father) of the Word. God and His Word being one I believe is a concept that comes from this verse rather than the ones you listed above:

Before the world was created, the Word already existed; He was with God, and He was the same as God. John 1:1

I think this is the verse that actually suggests unity of God and His Word (Christ) which is also the Son of God.