Is God progressive?

Dondi · 12-02-2006, 03:29 PM

The bible states that God changeth not. And I can agree that as far as His Nature He is Holy, Good, Just, Merciful, Ever Forgiving, etc.

However, I wonder in creating Man that God is learning about us as we learn about Him. We can say that God is All-Knowing, but does that preclude Him from gaining understanding about the world that He created.

We learn from knowledge (i.e, book knowledge), but we also learn from experience. Indeed, is not experience in many cases more valuable than book knowledge?

I was going to put this in the Abrahamic forum, but I think it would be good to see what other faiths believe.

wil · 12-02-2006, 04:46 PM

I think that man has created G-d in his image.

So as man grows in understanding, man's understanding of what G-d truly is progresses.

When man was at the mercy of nature, fighting for survival on all fronts, G-d looks different. When man did not have telescope, G-d and heaven were perceived above what we could see...and the stars were named the heavens.

We've grown in our knowledge...and will continue to, and our understanding of G-d will continue to change. Although some hold onto the notions of the past...not to say those notions don't have some value. We have people who still believe the old notions and it serves them as they wish.

cavalier · 12-02-2006, 05:23 PM

I can only see that this would depend on your view of God. If God is limited then yes, God would/could be progressive. If unlimited then surely God can't be progressive.

arthra · 12-02-2006, 06:38 PM

My view as a Baha'i is that God progressively reveals Himself to humanity over time and as needed for our advancement...so each age has certain critical issues facing it and God reveals what is needed. Progressive Revelation is a concept most Baha'is are familiar with.

- Art

flowperson · 12-02-2006, 11:51 PM

Art:

I believe that I would agree most with your viewpoint in this. The farther out and deeper into G-d's Creation that we look, the more we are awed by its complexity, inner symmetry, and overall functionality in the support of life. From our perspective I would call that a purposeful and meaningful revelation of the care that G-d has for the Creation, in all its facets. As time goes on we discover more, and are more humbled by what has been done for us, not to us.

flow....

Dondi · 12-04-2006, 02:34 PM

arthia, flow,

I agree with the idea of progressive revelation. The works of God are just mindboggling, even God's nature is awsome, in His forgiveness and mercy.

But let me cite several examples of what I'm talking about. Before I do this, let me explain a little bit more on the kind of thing I'm asking here.

Scientists set up experiments to observe natural laws in action. Laboratory mice, for example, are subjected to different stimuli to see how they react and what kinds of behavior they exhibit.

I can help but wonder if God has set up such an experiment with us. Time and again in the bible, we see God changing his mind.

In Genesis 6, God repents that He made man and ends up starting over from scratch, as it were, by destroying all but eight souls in the Great Deluge.

And in Numbers 14, God was ready to destroy the stiff-necked people of Israel, but for the prayful intervention of Moses. God relented, but does not allow the current generation to see the proimised Land.

Then in I Samuel 8, God allows Israel to have a king rule over them, at the request of the people, as they see the other surrounding nations ruled by kings. But later, God regrets making Saul king in I Samuel 15.

Is this not God reacting after the fact? He seems at times baffled at the behavior of His people. I can't help but wonder that that as He observes us, He's wondering what we are going to do next.

flowperson · 12-04-2006, 04:13 PM

Hi Dondi:
Perhaps He/She does not wonder regarding what WE might do next as He/She already knows all of the answers, or rather all of the possible alternative outcomes in accord with the choices that we might make. It is our collective responsibility to heed appropriate revelations and to adjust our behaviors/progress accordingly.

Looking at examples as presented in Bible verses MIGHT give us some indication of what things may transpire in the future, but ultimately it is up to us in our designated roles as "created co-creators" to read the signs and wonders around us and do the right things to enable appropriate future conditions in the world for life to progress. IMO, that's what G-d needs and wants from us.

Only my opinion you understand....

flow....

Seeker_of_truth · 12-05-2006, 06:33 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by flowperson

Art:

I believe that I would agree most with your viewpoint in this. The farther out and deeper into G-d's Creation that we look, the more we are awed by its complexity, inner symmetry, and overall functionality in the support of life. From our perspective I would call that a purposeful and meaningful revelation of the care that G-d has for the Creation, in all its facets. As time goes on we discover more, and are more humbled by what has been done for us, not to us.

flow....

I agree.

cavalier · 12-05-2006, 07:49 AM

As we learn new things, do you think we forget some of the old?

Thomas · 12-05-2006, 10:48 AM

It is not God who grows –

it is we who grow in understanding.

Thomas

lunamoth · 12-05-2006, 05:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Thomas

It is not God who grows –

it is we who grow in understanding.

Thomas

Very nice Thomas. That's how I think of it as well.

luna

Dondi · 12-05-2006, 05:37 PM

So you are saying that God has no need for experiential knowledge? That God doesn't learn?

lunamoth · 12-05-2006, 05:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dondi

So you are saying that God has no need for experiential knowledge? That God doesn't learn?

Hi Dondi, who are you asking?

luna

wil · 12-05-2006, 05:53 PM

How could the entity that knows all, know more?

Ever expanding universe?

Thomas, you da bomb, you say in clearly in 13 words....
Where I used over 50 words and get misunderstood?

And when I go minimalist...I get way misconstrued..

Dondi · 12-05-2006, 06:00 PM

No one in particular. I am getting a concensus that it's not God that is progressive, but us.

Let me put it like this. Is there nothing that we do that surprises God? As a father, I find myself surprised all the time by what my kids say and do. I delight when my children have learned something on their own.

One example is at thanksgiving when I had everyone go around the table and tell us what they are thankful for. My youngest daughter, age 9, said, "I'm thankful that my parents are not too strict, but not too easy on me." And that threw me back as it was totally unexpected. For it told me that she gets it now, she gets it. That the discipline we give our kids is to teach them the values my wife and I share, and that there has to be a balance of velvet and steel.

I just thought that was neat. That I must be doing something right after all.