Interfaith Toldot

[pohaikawahine]

are we at the part now where Isaac is old and wants to bless his son before he dies .... the words are so "I may solemnly bless you" in English, but the commentary says the Hebrew word (nafshi) literally means "my life-breath may bless you" .... so Isaac is almost blind and he will rely on the sequence of taste, touch and smell (insted of sound) to identify his supposed firstborn .... here we begin to get to the heart of the question about the firstborn .... why is Rebekah so willing to deceive Isaac by concealing the identity of Jacob ? Why do the brothers never speak to each other in the series of dialogues ? Why is Esau so unhappy with the blessing that Isaac bestows on him because he is told that by rebelling he shall break the yoke of his brother from his neck ? As twins, is there really a firstborn ?

[Bandit]

Originally Posted by pohaikawahine

Why is Esau so unhappy with the blessing that Isaac bestows on him because he is told that by rebelling he shall break the yoke of his brother from his neck ? As twins, is there really a firstborn ?

that is kind of what i was trying to say about my Pastor & his twin brother who is assistant & how they work together to achieve so much. but no one seemed to catch that. i dont think there is really a firstborn when you have twins.

a few minutes just does not seem the same as a few years or even one year.
makes ya wonder.

[pohaikawahine]

are we at the "stone pillow" part yet .... this is the whole piece on Jacob's ladder which is one of my favorites .... I still use the string figures to make Jacob's ladder (this is from that old game of cat's cradle) and cultures all over the world have this same figure in the strings .... I also have a piece to share on the emerald tablets (which I have mentioned before) because the interpretation of those tablets were suppose to have come after resting on a "stone pillow" .... gotta go for now but will return .... what do others think the "stone pillow" is all about? aloha nui, pohaikawahine

[Bandit]

Originally Posted by pohaikawahine

are we at the "stone pillow" part yet .... this is the whole piece on Jacob's ladder which is one of my favorites .... I still use the string figures to make Jacob's ladder (this is from that old game of cat's cradle) and cultures all over the world have this same figure in the strings .... I also have a piece to share on the emerald tablets (which I have mentioned before) because the interpretation of those tablets were suppose to have come after resting on a "stone pillow" .... gotta go for now but will return .... what do others think the "stone pillow" is all about? aloha nui, pohaikawahine

Hi Poh
i know we discussed this part before (cant recall where now) & it was pretty cool . i guess the thing i like about the string trick, looking back now, are all the different possiblities that can be, with a simple piece of string.

[pohaikawahine]

aloha e bandit ... yes we did discuss the string figures before and they are very universal, some of them cannot even be replicated today they are so complex .... and I also remember your reference to the twins ....


I think the "stone pillow" is actually in the next parsha, so I'll wait until we get there to get back to the question about the "stone pillow" .... I'm trying to follow both the Zohar and the Torah readings at the same time to see the perspectives within each .... the Zohar does not follow in the same sequence and crosses between many texts so it is difficult to connect to the parsha sequences at times, but I'll keep trying .... I'm also trying to understand the inner meanings of the Song of Songs as it relates to understanding the Torah ...

Dauer or anyone else .... are there any references to the Macabees in the Torah or any portion .... I know they are referenced in the Apocrypha (which means hidden things), but I am under the understanding that the Apocrypha is not accepted as part of the Torah? I read that Chanukah commerates the victory, through the miracles of HaShem of a small branch of Maccabbes over the Syrian-Greeks who ruled over Ertz Ysrale (the land of Israel) and it is a holiday of renewed dedication. Still trying to understand, poh

[dauer]

Sorry. Something came up unexpectedly and I've been away. We can pick up next week since the week is half way through. I don't believe Maccabees are ever mentioned in any way in the Tanach. Their books are indeed apocryphal.

Dauer

[pohaikawahine]

welcome back .... we missed you dauer .... I did read that the chronicles of the Maccabees are not included in the Hebrew Bible because the Men of the Great Assembly had decided many years earlier what the Hebrew Bible should consist of and these events occurred much later in time. The Books of the Maccabees, which were probably written by a Hasmonean chronicler, can be found in a collection called Sefer HaChitzonim which also contains other writings left out of the Hebrew Bible and which are not mentioned or quoted in the Talmud. I find this so interesting because the Maccabbes play such an important role in Judaism and the name Maccabee is reportedly an acronym for mi komocho ba'alim Hashem, "who is like you among the powers O God"* and of course the direct connection to Chanukah.


*another version of this is that the name Maccabee is the initials of the verse "Mi Chamocha B'elim Hasem" -- "Who is compared to You among the mighty, Oh Lord" (Exodus 15:11)

I'm still looking forward to some other thoughts on that "stone pillow" .... aloha nui, poh

[dauer]

I think the stone pillow is a rock, a symbol of the wilderness.

[pohaikawahine]

and it may be just as you suggest dauer .... have you ever heard of the emerald tablet, molded out of a single piece of ermerald or green crystal and which is the basis for alchemy - it is suppose to contain the sum of all knowledge and is connected with Hermes Trismegistus, he who is threefold in wisdom .... a young boy named Balinas, born in the year 16 C.E. in Tyana, Cappadocia (part of which is now Turkey) was one who was able to grasp the inner meaning of the tablet ....part of this story is that his head is propped against a stone where he dreams of an old man standing next to the opening of a cave and he is told to enter this cave to gain knowledge of the secrets of creation. The emerald tablet describes seven steps of transformation .... this is very similar to Jacob's vision of the ladder which he has a vision of afer falling asleep in a field with his head on a rock and jacob's ladder is usually associated with seven steps ....


the stone pillow continues to play an important role in the scripture .... Jacob takes the stone that he had put at his head and "he set it as a pillar and poured oil over its top .... and he called the name of that place Bethel" .... and then again "this stone that I set as a pillar will be a house of God, and everything that You give me I will surely tithe it to You."

aloha nui, poh