Interfaith as a Faith

[RubySera_Martin]

Originally Posted by bolo

Of course there are many hundreds of thousands of such fundamentalist organisations eagerly waiting for the chance of a polite invitation to ‘interfaith’ (e.g. spread their somewhat coloured version of truth and light) with more trusting types.

Virtually all of these sort of highly intolerant groups are connected to the larger religious lobby organisations which in itself is quite a sobering thought! The forces of fundamentalism rely on public trust, gullibility and conditioning to survive.

I wonder, do you consider their particular views to be fair and balanced or "extreme"?

Bolo, I have done enough formal studying of fundamentalism to know that you are absolutely right no matter how offensive this truth is to some people. The part of your post that I made blue is something I didn't know and it is frightening.

Two years ago there were three hundred megachurches in the US alone, and the number was growing faster than scholars could count. For a congregation to count as megachurch, there have to be at least two thousand worshippers every week. Most megachurches have more like six to ten thousand worshippers per week. All the megachurch faith statements I read are fundamentalist. We are talking about serious numbers here.

These numbers are the underlying threat to our planet.

[neosnoia]

Originally Posted by bolo

Interfaith with intolerant missionary forces that claim the total monopoly on truth is both ludicrous and amazingly silly!

Was it ludicrous and silly for someone to interfaith with me when I was a fundamentalist? I'm not anymore, and that is why. I'd say it's not a lost cause.

[RubySera_Martin]

Originally Posted by neosnoia

Was it ludicrous and silly for someone to interfaith with me when I was a fundamentalist? I'm not anymore, and that is why. I'd say it's not a lost cause.

Kay, you bring light with you. I've been thinking about this interfaithing thing. I used to be a fundamentalist, too, at least outwardly. I found it most frustrating that people interfaithed so much that they always just applauded our way of life and never shared their own views. The minute I left the church people started talking more honestly with me. It was as though they had not dared speak honestly before for fear of offending. I am glad one fundy was helped out of the trap by interfaithing. Thanks for brightening my day, Kay.

Ruby

[neosnoia]

You are very welcome Ruby.

I wasn't an easy sell. I was a pretty adamant person. I didn't want to hear anything I thought was "apostacy."

Time and patience and study and meditation won out.

[RubySera_Martin]

Originally Posted by InLove

Ruby, while you were posting here, I was posting what I thought might be something of interest to you on one of your threads on the LC board. I did not know you perceived me this way, or I would not have bothered you anymore, either. My sincere apologies.

InPeace,
InLove

Unfortunately, there is no forgiveness on this site. Brian tells me once we have posted something we have to take responsibility whether or not we apologize. Deleting a post is a form of apology. I deleted my post as a form of apology. He rejects it. I guess that applies across the board. Apologies don't count. People have been telling me it's the law of the jungle out there. I'm beginning to believe it.

[RubySera_Martin]

Originally Posted by neosnoia

You are very welcome Ruby.

I wasn't an easy sell. I was a pretty adamant person. I didn't want to hear anything I thought was "apostacy."

Time and patience and study and meditation won out.

This tells me you're an honest person. You do your own thinking. A woman after my own heart.

[lunamoth]

Originally Posted by RubySera_Martin

Unfortunately, there is no forgiveness on this site. Brian tells me once we have posted something we have to take responsibility whether or not we apologize. Deleting a post is a form of apology. I deleted my post as a form of apology. He rejects it. I guess that applies across the board. Apologies don't count. People have been telling me it's the law of the jungle out there. I'm beginning to believe it.

Ruby, my olive branch is still extended, with my apologies for speaking from my unchecked emotions, rather than from someplace better in my heart. I am only human.

lunamoth

[RubySera_Martin]

Originally Posted by lunamoth

Ruby, my olive branch is still extended, with my apologies for speaking from my unchecked emotions, rather than from someplace better in my heart. I am only human.

lunamoth

Thanks, Luna. I see you're in an impossible situation. Brian won't allow you to exonerate a person. You're between a rock and a hard place. It's not your fault. Sorry for the blasting. I'm human, too.

Ruby

[lunamoth]

Originally Posted by RubySera_Martin

Thanks, Luna. I see you're in an impossible situation. Brian won't allow you to exonerate a person. You're between a rock and a hard place. It's not your fault. Sorry for the blasting. I'm human, too.

Ruby

Thank you Ruby. However, don't be hard on Brian. I think he wanted to see us work this out, to allow both of us to see our words out there as the world sees them.

Peace, and looking forward to more fruitful conversations with you in the future,

luna

[RubySera_Martin]

Originally Posted by lunamoth

However, don't be hard on Brian.

Not accepting an apology is unforgiveable.

There's more to that story than the world knows. I did NOT want to delete that post.

However, someone suggested via pm that it was not a good thing to post. I wanted to leave it up anyway. I was sure the edit had timed out.

It hadn't. So that excuse didn't work. I figured it was my civil duty to delete it.

Then I get blamed for all kinds of nasty things, not least of which is the accusation Brian levels at me for "pretending" I had not said it.

I am human and I think I have the right to be treated like one.

[RubySera_Martin]

Originally Posted by InLove

Ruby, while you were posting here, I was posting what I thought might be something of interest to you on one of your threads on the LC board. I did not know you perceived me this way, or I would not have bothered you anymore, either. My sincere apologies.

InPeace,
InLove

I've just been on the LC section and I found nothing posted by you that was even remotely offensive to me. So either I didn't find it or I had no problem with it. Thought you might like to know that.

Ruby

[I, Brian]

Hm, think I need to address a few points here:

Originally Posted by RubySera_Martin

Bolo, this is not in the least surprising. You ARE the enemy to fundamentalists. You point out their secret tricks. InLove doesn't like you doing that. It will hurt InLove's trade.

That's a pretty sad comment to make. You accuse "fundies" of all sorts of interesting discriminations, but you appear to have absolutely no problem applying them yourself.

I see pot calling kettle black here - all the more sad because InLove isn't even a kettle here...

Originally Posted by RubySera_Martin

Unfortunately, there is no forgiveness on this site. Brian tells me once we have posted something we have to take responsibility whether or not we apologize. Deleting a post is a form of apology. I deleted my post as a form of apology. He rejects it. I guess that applies across the board. Apologies don't count. People have been telling me it's the law of the jungle out there. I'm beginning to believe it.

Since when does deleting a post count as an apology?? It doesn't in the slightest. Again, you refuse to take responsibility for your words in the public domain.

If you want something to look like an apology try normal apologetic words such as "sorry" and "apologise", instead of just brushing it all under the carpet and then acting surprised that people felt hurt by your comments.

Originally Posted by RubySera_Martin

Not accepting an apology is unforgiveable.

Then I get blamed for all kinds of nasty things, not least of which is the accusation Brian levels at me for "pretending" I had not said it.

I am human and I think I have the right to be treated like one.

I think you also have the right to be treated as a grown up by acting like one.

All I see here is someone who thinks it's their right to lash out, then acts surprised when they're held to account for it.

I've done a lot to try and help you here Ruby, but at present it feels that you're simply throwing it all back in my face.

You complained about conservative Christians posting on the Liberal Christianity board - but had no problems then going to the Christianity board to tell the mainstreamers that they were deluded. You see anything ironic in that?

Do be aware that as a host for an multifaith site, I'm not going to take sides against anyone's personal belief, whether they're considered liberal or conservative or anything else. We have some great liberals here, and some great conservatives, and some great people who don't fit easily into any pigeon-hole.

But also be aware that if you feel you have to challenge the words of other people for their beliefs, then in all fairness they have every right to challenge your words, too.

ADDED: Also, I've removed the ability for members to delete their posts. Perhaps this will help people think more carefully about posting in anger, but if not, we'll simply have to work out the issues raised.

[kenod]

There does seem to be some rather divergent views on what is described as Christian fundamentalism. As one reviewer quipped, anyone to the right of Spong is a fundamentalist in some eyes; whereas for others, it means you blow up abortion clinics.

Fundamentalism is not about the way you behave, it is about what you believe ... I know, I'm one! The binding doctrine among the very different groups of fundamentalists is that the Bible is the inerrant Word of God. We believe it is literally true, although it does also contain figurative language (eg Jesus sitting on the right hand of God).

So we believe in the virgin birth, the miracles, the resurrection, and so on. Some have claimed it is a new phenomenon when in fact it is what Christianity has embraced for most of the past 2000 years.

Whether fundamentalists are forceful in projecting their beliefs or not, says more about individual personality than it does about fundamentalism.

There is a belief that Jesus Christ is the Truth, and that other religions are not all equivalent paths to God. Personally, I agree with that, although I would add that an alternative path may be right for a particular person or group.

It seems that holding the view you have found The Truth is not very popular today. And God forbid that you should dare try to influence public policy ... eg, if you oppose same-sex rights you'll get called homophobic (not so long ago the gay lobby was complaining because they got called names ).

Should we respect individuals ... yes, of course we should ... but that does not mean we have to agree with them. Problem is, if you don't allow that every view is equally valid, you will get called disrespectful anyway

[arthra]

Hello Kenod

and welcome!

That "Spong" you mentioned in your last post would be "Bishop John Shelby Spong" I take it...

As a bona fide "fundamentalist" Kenod and someone whom I have never met before and with whom I have never conived with to set up any conspiracies..

I was curious about your feelings about particpating say in an inter-faith program... What would be your apprehensions if any... or any reservations...What are your ideas?

- Art

[RubySera_Martin]

Originally Posted by I, Brian

ADDED: Also, I've removed the ability for members to delete their posts. Perhaps this will help people think more carefully about posting in anger, but if not, we'll simply have to work out the issues raised.

How I wish you'd had this insight two days ago. Then this whole nasty thing would not have happened. If you don't believe me go check what I said before you removed that function.

This is your site and it will be what you make of it. If you wish to betray confidences and post stuff from personal emails on the public forum, as you did with me, then so be it.

Feel free to delete my membership and everything I wrote. But understand that I am not sorry for anything I have posted and that it will be just fine with me if all my posts on this thread (including this one) remain.