Ethics of Euthanasia

[Francis king]

...when my dad found out he had motor neurone disease, he set aside a stash of pills and whiskey, and he told me that when he felt the end was near and he could not put it off any longer, he would kill himself, to spare others the burden of his care... unfortunately for him, he was too busy clinging onto life to instate such noble ideals, and he missed his window of opportunity... knowing the end was near, and unable to move, he asked my teenage brother to help him kill himself... being a youth of 18, he could not do it, and so eventually my dad died in agony with pneumonia in hospital...

...diseases like MND are not nice to have- he really suffered, and eventually, after his body had died and was like stone he eventually lost the ability to even communicate, but mentally he was very alive right until the very end, terrified to die, disgusted at himself for being dependent on others, yet unable to kill himself or even breathe unassisted... how terrible it was for him, to be trapped in such a useless body, a man who relied on his physical strength all his life, and watch himself ebb away, his dreams unrealised... how terrible it was for my brother, who took on the burden of care, and as a result did not manage to do his A levels because he was carrying my father up and down stairs to bathe him and wipe his bum... how terrible it was to discover that there was a drug on the market which would have extended my fathers life by about three years but which he was ineligible for because of no other reason than he was poor, and he was not worthy of the investment...

...sometimes it is better to die, than to suffer, with no quality of life... sometimes it is better to kill yourself than suffer agonies from which there is no escape, and sometimes it is the right and noble thing to do, to kill yourself, or another, to end suffering...

death is inevitable... we will all die... if we cannot breathe unaided, we cannot feed ourselves, if we cannot recover from our painful illnesses, it is natural that we die, yet the medical profession does not like death, views it is failure, so they pump ppl full of drugs and keep them on machines and allow them to endure agonies which would be preventable if nature was allowed to take its course...

I often see stories on TV about ppl who should, by rights, be dead but who are kept alive by their loved ones because the loved one cannot make the decision to end their loved ones life, and it upsets me... I feel that the decision to participate in an assisted suicide is a great burden, and one which should not be made by relatives, and one which also cannot be made by medics, but should be legislated for, and I would like to see every city have a service like Dignitas, so that those who know the end is near can have their needs met, and die with dignity...

[17th Angel]

"I feel that the decision to participate in an assisted suicide is a great burden, and one which should not be made by relatives, and one which also cannot be made by medics," - Francis King.

A burden? I have not had the experience you have, and first of all, sorry for your loss.....

I couldn't see how it would be a burden if you are asked to kill someone you love, I would hope I could kill someone I loved if they were in so much pain and intense suffering... I would also hope I if asked a family memeber to help take my life they would.... Hopefully that will never be the case, it's like if you hit an animal on the road... To be of mercy and to be kind/loving... I personally would stop and check the animal could be saved or is dead, if it cannot be saved, then to put it out from its pain and terror..

You also mentioned about medication that could have extended his life for three years? Would that be back to his former life? or another three years of pain? Because I would imagine that would be more of a burden and not as kind as euthanasia.. And you mention that the descision to take ones life shouldn't be the loved ones descision? but the medics? Aren't they the ones that put prices on peoples heads? And may use people as mere experiments? Doctors and such have cold hearts when it comes to other peoples loss... They deal with it every day, another day at the office, you become numb to a constant exposure to anything... a resitance is built. I think the loved ones should be able to decide to let go of an ill family memeber. But if not family memebers? and not doctors then who?

[juantoo3]

Kindest Regards, Francis King!

Originally Posted by Francis king

I would like to see every city have a service like Dignitas, so that those who know the end is near can have their needs met, and die with dignity...

For all its worth, you have my sympathies over the loss of your father. In America we do have a service available so the dying "can have their needs met, and die with dignity." Here we call it Hospice. While legally, euthanasia is frowned on, Hospice does what they can to insure the patient is comfortable and not suffering, and it assists the caregivers. A lot of people here are not aware of the service, or shy away because of the subject matter until it is too late. In my mind Hospice is a very valuable service, for precisely the reasons you mention.

Legally, I don't think euthanasia should be encouraged. Having said this, I would probably act much like your father, hording my little stash for the last moment, and then probably wait too long and let the moment pass. I keep telling myself I will simply take a long walk into the woods and not come back...

I have my reasons for not encouraging euthanasia...I think it would ultimately end up creating a market for human parts, a concept I find disgusting. I keep being reminded of the old movie "Soylent Green." Yet, I am not averse to capital punishment...I think it should be done on the village square; make a day of it, bring the kids, grandma, the dog...

[17th Angel]

So it would be ok to kill those that have nothing at all wrong with them? Just because of a crime they MAY have commited? Not all executed are guilty... And some who were guilty shouldn't have been killed.... Tookie Williams anyone? *burns a portrait of arnold schwarzenenger heh*

But then, those who would find comfort and peace in death shouldn't be killed? Well thats... messed up lol.

[Francis king]

17th, I see it as a burden becuase, even though you and the other are in agreement about the action, you, as the helper, then have to contend with the guilt of killing a loved one, and you also have to dodge the police, who will try and have you incarcerated...

I don't feel the medical profession should decide who lives and who dies, and nor do I feel the family should be forced to make this decision either- I think that the medics could leave themselves open to blame, and so too could the family, and so I think that the decision should be made by the ill person, in a form of living will. However, to make this legal, government would have to legislate and make this acceptable...

yes, the medication would have extended his life, had he been prescribed it when first diagnosed, it would have halted the progression of the illness, and gave him around three more years of life, whether he would have then still been in pain is likely...

[Francis king]

oh, and juantoo... yes, we also have hospices here, but all they can do is try and make ur last days as comfortable as possible, they cannot bump u off...

it seems bizzare to me that on the one hand, u can be a fan of capital punishment, but not assisted suicide- which causes me to wonder if u, like many others, view death as a punishment, rather than a natural occurance...?

[17th Angel]

Originally Posted by Francis king

it seems bizzare to me that on the one hand, u can be a fan of capital punishment, but not assisted suicide- which causes me to wonder if u, like many others, view death as a punishment, rather than a natural occurance...?

lol like I said... I think he's been eating my brownies again...