depression

[cavalier]

This may be the wrong forum, I'm not sure.

Someone I care about is suffering with depression. I wonder if any of you has any experience or knowledge in this area, if you could tell me what the best things are that I can do to support that person, and myself.

If anyone can help or advise, please reply or PM. Thank you.

[seattlegal]

Exercise can work wonders, with much more desirable side effects than medications might have. I couldn't hurt to give it a try.

[Dondi]

Without much detail on why this person is depressed, I would be hard pressed to give any advise. Even then, any attempt to solicite advise would be from a laymen's perspective. Has this person sought professional help?

[17th Angel]

Originally Posted by seattlegal

Exercise can work wonders

So can drugs.

[Tao_Equus]

Originally Posted by 17th Angel

So can drugs.

The consesus amongst GP's here in the UK according to a recently published report is that the modern armoury of drugs do nothing to help those with mild to moderate depression. The most effective treatment is simply having someone to talk to about it, a good diet and plenty of outdoor excersise. The company of a good freind for a picnic on a mountaintop will lift anyones mood.

Severe depression is another ball game and the person should be encouraged at every turn to seek medical help.

Tao

[17th Angel]

Originally Posted by Tao_Equus

The consesus amongst GP's here in the UK according to a recently published report is that the modern armoury of drugs do nothing to help those with mild to moderate depression. The most effective treatment is simply having someone to talk to about it, a good diet and plenty of outdoor excersise. The company of a good freind for a picnic on a mountaintop will lift anyones mood.

Severe depression is another ball game and the person should be encouraged at every turn to seek medical help.

Tao

Swings an round abouts I guess.... :\ They fixed me up I haven't been depressed for like a decade or more now. from the age of 14 I waved bub bye to the blues.

[flowperson]

Hi Cav...Sorry to hear about your friend. I've been there and it's definitely the "black dog" as Churchill ( who suffered mightily with his ) used to call it. In my situation, I was bipolar, up/down all the time, when I once lived in a certain place.

I did smoke drugs at the time to try and self medicate, but that only made the mood swings worse. I'd had bad experiences with the docs previously, so before I resorted to that I cut out all meat from my diet, mostly ate fruits and veggies and organic dairy, exercised in the sunlight as much as possible, and tried to be out of doors as much as possible. I also took a lot of dietary supplements and vitamins. Kava and St. John's Wort were especially helpful. Little by little I came out of it after I finally moved from the bad place. A terrible time in my life. But it eventually does get better.

By all means seek professional help if self help doesn't dent the clouds. Best wishes to you and yours.

flow....

[Pathless]

Originally Posted by cavalier

This may be the wrong forum, I'm not sure.

Someone I care about is suffering with depression. I wonder if any of you has any experience or knowledge in this area, if you could tell me what the best things are that I can do to support that person, and myself.

If anyone can help or advise, please reply or PM. Thank you.

Aye, professional help is important. Depression is the big bad bugbear in my closet. Exercise, movement, creative pursuits, cognitive therapy, more time for play and silliness, being outside, being present in the moment, cutting out TV and computer (TV easy, computer hard), and generally making more time for my interests and passions are all things that I have done to get my depression under control. I also take medication, and I think that is important. I don't really like having to take medicine, but like hell much less, so I do take it.

As far as taking a supportive role, the best thing that people can do for me when I am down and out is to not give advice, but just listen. Depression is a very personal hell and I don't think that other people can have any idea what an individual is struggling with, much less give helpful advice to 'fix' them. I think the struggle is highly individualized for each person. It's very helpful to have people who are availabe to listen and a professional (therapist or counselor) to be able to work with. Don't scrimp on therapy. Find someone who is highly qualified, comes highly recommended, and who is a personal fit.

To an extent, depression is a bit contagious, Cav. Be aware of how your friend's depression may be affecting your own mood. You should set boundaries, and not suffer because he/she is. I am sure that you want to be helpful to this person, and that is great, but recognize that your own mood and mental health are equally as important, and that your supportive role is not one of fixing or curing. Your friend will have to do that work.


My thoughts, and best wishes for you and yr friend,
P

[Muslimwoman]

I am right with Pathless on this one Cav. I have bipolar (manic depression) it is hell on earth and not something you can snap out of.

It does depend if your friend has 'natural' depression (after a death or bad experience) or medical (no external reason)?

If you read a lot just sit in the room and read quietly, that would help me. I want to be alone but not alone if you know what I mean, so I don't want to be offered coffee or chatted to but I want to know I am not alone in the world.

Pathless also made a good point about not letting it rub off on you, be very careful about that. It is so easy to be sucked into our black mood.

Good luck with it and bless you for supporting your friend through a horrible experience.

Salaam
MW

[Caimanson]

I am in a similar situation Cavalier.
I am still learning, I suppose what I am discovering for my self is not to take things too seriously and keep enjoying life as best as I can. I say this because it can affect people around sufferers very powerfully.

If you can, get hold of a book called "Depression and how to survive it" by Spike Milligan and Anthony Clarke. It is a layman's introduction to the subject and some insight into what it is to be depressed.


Oh, I forgot: acceptance, acceptance, acceptance.
Accept your situation, don't expect miracle cures, learn to live with it as best as you can, but don't try to fight it.
In my situation this applies to myself but very specially to the person that is suffering the condition.

[Impqueen]

I also have (mild) depression. Having someone to talk to helps, as does occupying my brain when otherwise it would wander off into dark stuff (radio 4 is a sanity saver!). Hugs and massages are good.

Just a note on St. John's Wort... it should be avoided by those on the contraceptive pill as it has been shown to interfere. The last thing you need when depressed is a surprise pregnancy.... of course, if you're friend is male or not sexually active that's irrelevant!

I make up a massage oil I call my happy oil. 50ml base oil (I like sweet almond oil, grapeseed would also be fine), 5 drops each of lavender, mandarin and ylang-ylang essential oils. Do not use essential oils in pregnancy unless advised by a qualified aromatherapist - I am not a qualified aromatherapist! And always do a spot test of a new oil mix on your inner elbow before smothering yourself in it. If there's no adverse reaction in 24 hours, smother away.

[cavalier]

Thanks for the advice guys.

My friend is going to go and see a doctor. This is a big step because in Taiwan there is a huge stigma attached to problems like this. There is also a huge waiting list so the first appointment is not until Oct 20th.

Thanks again, and if anyone has anything else..

[Muslimwoman]

Originally Posted by cavalier

There is also a huge waiting list so the first appointment is not until Oct 20th.

Egypt too has a stigma problem with depression but the doctors that choose to work in this field tend to be very understanding and have moved on from the stereotypes.

Great news that your friend is seeking help, it is not something we can cope with alone. I wish them the best of luck.

[Francis king]

I am sorry I did not find this post before as I would have said then what I am saying now, but I will leave this post in case it benefits another...

...studies in germany and other european countries have found that for mild to moderate depression, a short course of St Johns Wort works a treat... I have also tried it myself, and can confidently say it elevated my mood a little, and that was all I needed, although I did experience mild photophobia (light senstitivity-bright sunlight hurt my eyes...)

if u have liver problems, pregnant, already sensitive to light or naturally aggressive it might harm you, (if u are naturally aggressive it might make u more so..) but beyond that... u can buy it in the healthfood store... its cheap (around seven GB pounds a bottle), and they reccommend u take it for a course- which is around three months...

if you feel u would rather trust conventional medicine, then there are many options for the treatment of depression- although they are usually medicines, rather than other kinds of treatment...

...it is difficult in the UK to get access to most types of psychological therapies, such as CBT, difficult to get anything like Rogerian therapy, or any of the fringe types, such as Gesalt, although you will be able to see a psychiatrist, it will take a while unless you are so severely screwed up you present yourself to casualty or cause a scene in a public place... if you are employed by a large company, or at university, or if you are in certain trade unions, you might be able to seek psychological therapies via their systems, and if you think the waiting time is excessive, and a person needs more urgent treatment you can complain, but not everyone is able to do these things.

A GP in your local practise can prescribe you anti-depressants, and if you are feeling so low you really cannot function then, no shame in taking a few pills...

however; creating psychiatric drugs, especially for "common" "illnesses" such as depression is a lucrative market...

...anti-depressants come and go on the market- not all of them stay, because sometimes they makes things worse... Prozac, the most popular antidepressant in the 1990's was given to a lot of ppl. Some of those ppl went on to commit suicide. It was discovered that it was, in fact, the drug, and not the depression, which had caused this, and there is now in most cases a world wide ban on the prescribing of Prozac...

In the UK Prozac is still available, but it is not available to young depressed people- as they are already more at risk of suicide than older ppl, and it has been found that young depressed ppl who take Prozac are more likely to commit suicide than young depressed ppl without Prozac...

so...for some ppl, some drugs work, and some drugs make things worse. If you are aware a friend or family member is taking drugs with the intention of positively affecting their psychological functioning and they appear to be getting worse after about 4-6 weeks, then contact their prescriber, just in case...

..other things which help are: watching ur diet and making sure u eat well, keeping in touch with positive friends and family members, getting regular exersise, making sure u sleep enough, and try to keep going...

Conventional medicine dictates that there's two types of depression-endogenous, and reactive...

reactive depression is, as the name suggests, depression which comes on as a reaction to something else- a bad relationship, a traumatic death, a bad birth or a serious life complication, say, a series of knockbacks which create apathy and despondency, etc, and then we have endogenous depression, which they say is a genetic predisposition reaching potentiality, but personally I think is often instead related to a specific hormone imbalance- too much estrogen in women, for instance, or too little testosterone in men, or related to cortisol reuptake (and therefore stress related), or due to a thyroid dysfunction, etc, and the manifestation of the syptoms are the result of a maladaptive coping strategy, but not everyone would agree with that...

Often depression is considered an illness, but personally I do not feel it is an illness in the true sense, as in, the body is invaded with bacteria, or a virus, or has some organ or blood defect, but is instead a psychological disorder brought about by some kind of maladaptive coping strategy which is being played out due to some kind of trauma or existential crisis, or series of small traumas, which a person has not been able to deal with...

A cold mother, the death of a loved one, losing a good job... things like this happen to everyone... we hurt, then we eventually grow again, and start to get on with things... but sometimes we can't- the fight is knocked out of us, the wind has gone from our sails, we are not just disappointed, but despondent, so low that we feel great affinity with anything which allows us to lie upon the floor, prostrate... it goes beyond just revelling in your own misery like a literary gothic romanticist, bemoaning your fate while dazzling the crowd...

you have to be careful though, as an observer, that you do not make things worse... yes, it would be great if ppl could just pull themselves together, take a few pills and everything would be back to normal- but it's sometimes not that easy...

sometimes what u see, this abnormal lack of drive, is actually quite normal... sometimes we need to retreat, lick our wounds, try to adjust to situations and circumstances...

everyone is different...

[Alex P]

Originally Posted by cavalier

Thanks for the advice guys.

My friend is going to go and see a doctor. This is a big step because in Taiwan there is a huge stigma attached to problems like this. There is also a huge waiting list so the first appointment is not until Oct 20th.

Thanks again, and if anyone has anything else..

Oi spoon bender! Noooo!

Where are ya? Haven't seen you in donkeys.... I hope your friend is doing ok?