Alchemy

[Rouge47]

Originally Posted by ProphetSmurf

Subject came up concerning Alchemy and the 'riddle'.

What, may I ask, is the 'riddle'? Is it another mystery to the secrets of alchemy, or exageration?

God Bless,
Paul

[Faithfulservant]

Originally Posted by ProphetSmurf

"The key to life and death is everywhere to be found, but if you do not find it in your own house, you will find it nowhere. Yet, it is before everyone's eyes; no one can live without it; everyone has used it. The poor usually possess more of it than the rich; children play with it in the streets. The meek and uneducated esteem it highly, but the privileged and learned often throw it away. When rejected, it lies dormant in the bowels of the earth. It is the only thing from which the Philosopher's Stone can be prepared, and without it, no noble metal can ever be created."

"When the answer cannot be put into words, neither can the question be put into words.The riddle does not exist.If a question can be framed at all, it is also possible to answer it."

Paul,

this was the riddle that Smurf posted.. You must have passed right by it

[pohaikawahine]

Originally Posted by ProphetSmurf

"The key to life and death is everywhere to be found, but if you do not find it in your own house, you will find it nowhere. Yet, it is before everyone's eyes; no one can live without it; everyone has used it. The poor usually possess more of it than the rich; children play with it in the streets. The meek and uneducated esteem it highly, but the privileged and learned often throw it away. When rejected, it lies dormant in the bowels of the earth. It is the only thing from which the Philosopher's Stone can be prepared, and without it, no noble metal can ever be created."

"When the answer cannot be put into words, neither can the question be put into words.The riddle does not exist.If a question can be framed at all, it is also possible to answer it."

so the question remains, what is it? is anyone going to try and solve the riddle .... this is like the question, what is the sound of one hand clapping (which is in another thread) .... me ke aloha pumehana, pohaikawahine

[Rouge47]

I wont try to solve it. Wow, im a video game guy not a riddler.

[ProphetSmurf]

There is an answer. Within each of us.

[pohaikawahine]

i think the answer might be 'love' .... and yes the answer is found within each of us .... we must manifest love to prepare the philosopher's stone .... just my thoughts .... aloha nui, poh

[Rouge47]

Originally Posted by pohaikawahine

i think the answer might be 'love' .... and yes the answer is found within each of us .... we must manifest love to prepare the philosopher's stone .... just my thoughts .... aloha nui, poh

Ever since my heart was broken I never really enjoyed love...

"She turned and laughed..." some people can be so cruel....

[InLove]

Hi, guys--peace to all--

My thoughts on alchemy may be a bit different--don't know much at all about "the sorcerer's stone". Sounds like something that would sell books and movies, though....

Alchemy was and is science and medicine. Without the pharmaceutical companies and the government. It is simply natural remedies that people throughout the ages have known about.

Just think about the barber pole. Have any of you seen it? It still remains outside some of the most sophisticated full-service salons and spas you see today. Do you know what the stripes mean? It all has to do with the early days of bloodletting--before barbers and doctors were a separate lot...

And to think that I thought that 1500 hours and a barber license, and everything my young Ozark mamma and daddy taught this "Native Texan" would actually prompt anyone to listen to me about something like alchemy

What exactly would you like to know?

InPeace,
InLove

[mahud]

"out of the eater
something to eat"

The philosopher's stone lies beyond the gateway of eternity, and the stone is the key that unlocks this
impenetrable door.

How can one gain possession of the stone if the mystery can only be wrought by the stone itself?

There are two doors, so i'm told. Often symbolized by the sun and that of the moon. The ever-revolving way of the moon is the temporal realm. the whole earth, air, fire and water, and... thing.

The creation and disolusion of all things meets at the solar gateway of eternity;

"where the god with three eyes
haf-closed/half open lies,
drunk from too much wine."

the riddle of the universe is a riddle not unlike the riddle of the stone itself. The alchmists knew that. Disconnection reconnection. same thing.

Temporality arose out of the eternal, and in turn the eternal must arise out of the temporal. Another riddle, or rather the same riddle.

The grail is a dish. A symbolic lunar/temporal dish that contains the solar/eternal drink of divine ambrosia.

The fisher king, 'He who saw the deep', knew this, and was wounded/healed by it, within his revolving castle. Disconnection reconnection. same thing.

....The snake slithered away.

[Rouge47]

My dad had some GREAT stuff on alchemies history! I'll see if he'll let me post it.

[Rouge47]

This stuff isn't my dad's but I came up with this on my own. I just sat down and thought about it. Before you read I would like you all to know that I'm bringing up relations to "free will" in connection to alchemy. Also, I would like everyone to know that I'm not rebelious in any way.

*Takes deep breath* Ok here we go...

According to the Bible we have "free will" but the laws of the earth set limitations to that "free will" and God does also say that we need to obey the laws set forth by the kingdom of the earth. So do we really have "free will?"
We have a right to do what we want but there are of coarse consequences to those things (or rewards). If we are afraid of the consequences and chose not to do something because of those consequences then DO we have free will? The government(United States) is (I believe) taking away our free will if they are setting limits. This country(United States) was founded under God (or the religion of christianity). Therefor do we not have the RIGHT of FREE WILL? God has GIVEN us free will.

The definition of a RIGHT is, what I believe, a God given privilage. The rights to Life, Liberty, and the Pursuit of Happiness(US Declaration of Independence) are all God given rights. Therefor if God has given us the right of free will then shouldn't we be able to do what we want? God gave us a choice in the beginning and still does. True, if we do something wrong then we must be punished, but who says that we can't do what we want on the earth? I'm not being rebelious or anything, but this is a very interesting issue to discuss.

I believe that we DO have free will and that we CAN do what we want. I also believe that the laws (most of them) set forth by the government are reasonable. I also believe that if we do wrong (or sin, so to say) then we SHOULD be punished for it.

This brings me back to the Alchemy issue...

Because we have free will then shouldn't the alchemists choose what their belief should be? Did the Pope have a right to kill them? And didn't the witches, warlocks, and Atheists have the same free will as the alchemists? What is it that makes Man have the right to take away the rights of others?

This issue is definitly worth discussing! What are everyone elses point's of view's on this topic?

God Bless,
Paul

*Gasps for air* Whew! That took a lot out of my brain power!

P.S. To see the original version of this then please visit the Yahoo Group: "Faith-Exploration" You may also view other documents by Faith-Exploration members at the same group.

[Sean]

Originally Posted by Mythman

dear paul

not like you, I havn't been messing with alchemy niether cemestry
(please forgive me for my bad english- not a mother tounge), but I'll be happy to clear your head as best as I can try.

who started the alchemy and how it reached it's populerty till the middle ages I do not know. but I can tell you this...
in the early middle age as you know the money was in golden coins. many do not know but the reason that gold had been so populer is because first its attractive to the eye, and second is it's the best matriel that can be proserve after diamond (that is way when you see golden coins from sunken ship since the renesance its well preserve).
this second reason led the alchemists to belive that gold is the top matiriel in nature. they decided to try and creat gold from other basics of nature. and this how begen the prosute for gold in the spiritual form. the belive that gold is longest metirial on earth led to belive its symbolizing etrnety. this mistycal belive and the will of the lords for money florished the populerty of alchemy.

it was all nice and well untill the next thing happened....

in the dark age there were rumers of alchemists that created life from a lab bottles. those statements shook the church. and the church as the strongest body in europe in that time began a counter strike. and they blame the alchemists as devil worshipers. and siners (and many more....).

thou it became from a populer scince to a dark art.

the philosephers stone: this is a stone (or a bottle or something completly diffrent) that made from ingridients that hold the secret to eternal life or creating a humen being, or something else. the exact enterpetation of the stone is unknown

this case reminds me the case of tower of babylon in genesis.

may the sun shine worm on your face
the moon will show you'r way in dark
and the stars protect you at night

mythman

The church tried to stop alchemy in the middle ages but it actually helped modern medicine. When alchemists would try to turn lead into gold using natural ides as you said above, They would also come up with new Herbal Remedies too

[evva1]

Transfiguration.
They were transforming their old garment and self into new one, heavenly.
The philosopher stone or whatewer it has been called is inside of you - it's someones true beeing sometimes caled the Self. There are various names for it. Jewel in the lotos flower for eg.
You can find parables for it almost everywhere, in the New Testament, gnostic scriptures. C.G. Jung has done an amazing work of investigating and understanding alchemy. Etc....

[evva1]

Parallels, not parables.(see previous post).

[Rouge47]

Hello evva1,

Welcome to CR! I hope you enjoy it here! I know that I do!

God Bless,
Paul