5-yr olds caged

[wil]

Originally Posted by Muslimwoman

Maybe I should send flyers showing veiled girls playing with their ipods, getting good degrees at Uni and winning awards for business start ups?!
Here is a good one:

Saudi Woman Wins UN Award for Work With NGOs

Namaste MW,

As good as it is pesky old me must point out that was over two years ago, and ponder yeah, but what have you done for me lately. Also in reference to the below, I can't find any reference of the book which was being worked on. That sounds like something worth the world reading.

“This is an annual award and it is given to encourage development projects. It is the first time that a Saudi woman has received the award,” Dr. Al-Munajjed said.
Dr. Al-Munajjed has been working with several UN agencies on programs and social projects. She is the author of two published books and is currently working on a third book, which is based on personal interviews with 20 remarkable Saudi women who recount the events that shaped their lives and careers.

[Tao_Equus]

Wil

That is a fair point of view. But I still feel it is better for us to express outrage than remain curious anthropologists.

Tao

[wil]

Originally Posted by Tao_Equus

But I still feel it is better for us to express outrage than remain curious anthropologists.

Namaste Tao,

Tich Nat Hanh related a beautiful story about raising cabbage, and if they were not growing as they should would you yell at them, beat them, threaten to rip them out, or would you provide the water, nutrients, care so they could grow better and encourage them to produce the crop you desire?

Do you truly think outrage our best avenue of expression or concern, understanding and continuing dialog?

[Muslimwoman]

Originally Posted by Tao_Equus

Still does not balance the attrocities carried out in the name of Islam:
Pickpocket's hand amputated in Mecca

Oh the Saudi's lost the plot a long time ago but they are not demonstrative of the majority of Muslims.

Analysts say clerics of the kingdom's strict Wahhabi school fear they are losing their grip on society.

Losing their grip on reality more like. Are you aware that this looney sect of Islam has actually at one time declared all other Muslims as nonbeleivers? One of their crazy scholars actually declared jihad on the whole of the world, other than fellow wahhabis. We tend to just ignore them and treat them with the contempt they deserve.

Originally Posted by wil

As good as it is pesky old me must point out that was over two years ago, and ponder yeah, but what have you done for me lately. Also in reference to the below, I can't find any reference of the book which was being worked on. That sounds like something worth the world reading.

I wasnt trying to make any particular point about that lady, it was just a demonstration that Muslim women do achieve things outside the home and baby making. I posted that link as it was from Saudi and it is rare to find anywhere in the world where women are less respected.

I think to find her books you would have to search in Arabic. Nope they are in English, here is a review of one of her books called Saudi Women Speak:

More talk, less distortion by Kaelen Wilson-Goldie - Common Ground News Service

[Tao_Equus]

Originally Posted by wil

Namaste Tao,

Tich Nat Hanh related a beautiful story about raising cabbage, and if they were not growing as they should would you yell at them, beat them, threaten to rip them out, or would you provide the water, nutrients, care so they could grow better and encourage them to produce the crop you desire?

Do you truly think outrage our best avenue of expression or concern, understanding and continuing dialog?

Hi Wil,

Today I was at a World Development Movement (WDM) conference in Glasgow where the major topic of the afternoon discussion was on activism and how it can be expressed individually and politically. Part of this discussion of course ranged into the use of compulsion or force as a legitimate method of securing change.
Compulsion does not infer violence which I would only ever condone in actual defence, (not Bush style invading Iraq style 'defence'). But compulsion is the true be getter of change not weak dialogue. Outrage should be expressed on an individual and national level at obscene practices like execution and body mutilation and compulsion applied through pariah status being applied to nations that allow such human rights violations.
Being mildly miffed and expressing distaste never changed a thing ever. We need to take a lead in our global village and truly embrace the western liberal enlightenment in an aggressive way, not just pay lip service to grand ideals. We can freeze assets of leaders and state businesses and prevent and that way compel them to change.
And as for respecting cultural differences the first and foremost thing we all share is our common humanity, that never changes, we do not get or lose that by accident of place of birth. And we are all owe a duty of common humanity to our brothers and sisters wherever and under whatever culture they may live.
Being PC can be taken too far. Calling such action as I would support is called by some neo-colonialism. It is nothing of the kind. It is common humanity. I think western liberalism if rolled out on a global scale is not the imposition of colonial values but a quest for true equality and emancipation from outmoded historical baggage. In our global village we need global values. If we do not stand up in outrage and shout till we are heard then nothing will change.
Despite appearances most people are not cabbages and do have a desire to see justice for all. They just dont feel included enough in the debate to get actively involved. If they realised how truly paranoid and easily influenced the average politician is they might be more active. As few as 20 or so letters written to a politician is enough to get him to raise an issue. 100 and (s)he will campaign on it. But most people never bother because they have no idea it is that easy.
So while I do respect the position you take on it I do not agree with it. Millions die every year from things that are easy to fix with a healthy dose of activism led political changes. So I will continue to be outraged at barbaric practices and take it out on someone who is elected as my rep to the policy makers. If just 1% actively joined me then we would see change.

Regards
Tao

[flowperson]

Tao...You 'da man bragh !

flow....

[greymare]

oh I dont mean to be disrespectful Tao but you are hobnobbing in some very fine circles. Think of me when you are there. Love the Grey. oh and remember, Mum is the law. (share or no one gets it)

[Tao_Equus]

Dis?? You!!! lol what a novel thought!!! The WDM is not full of politicians but activists trying to lobby for a fairer deal for the developing world. If you are interested you can find out more about them here : World Development Movement - Justice for the world's poor

Respect Mum

Tao

[bob x]

"Despite appearances most people are not cabbages..."
Yes, lots of them are carrots!

[Muslimwoman]

Salaam Tao

Great link, thank you and keep up the good work.

Oh and can you get clean water for the poor people in my town please. (honestly it is nearly 2008 and my mother in law still has sludge coming out of her tap ). Not to worry though the town is trying to do somehing about it, although I am not sure zillions of gallons of chlorine is good for you.